Author Topic: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'  (Read 9334 times)

Offline FarEast

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 443
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #30 on: August 12, 2016, 09:01:32 PM »
Großartig!
I think sculpting a new Figure is the peak of modeling.
Awsome like the carriage.
Manni

thank you for the kind words - technically I only sculpted the torso - the legs and arms were sculpted by Masterbox and the head was Aviattic. So I guess I can take 1 third credit :D

Any way the sculpting is finished. I've already started painting the base tones and completed the face and hands so I should have an update of the finished driver tomorrow.

Also i went to the LBS and picked up some chain and braided line for the harness and jig.




Offline FarEast

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 443
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #31 on: August 12, 2016, 10:01:28 PM »
Sorry for the poor quality, taken with the phone camera.






Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 647
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #32 on: August 12, 2016, 10:23:50 PM »
I admire your skills, driver figure looks great.

Adam.

Offline lone modeller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3444
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #33 on: August 13, 2016, 03:07:05 AM »
Totally agree with Adam - figures are things that I have real problems with. You make it look easy - the sign of a very skilled modeller.

Stephen.

Offline GAJouette

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3577
  • " Beware of the Spanish Inquisition"
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #34 on: August 13, 2016, 03:33:04 AM »
 James,
I'll chime in with Adam and Stephen on your figure painting skills. I believe many of us are in the same boat when it concerns figures and no doubt we can certainly learn much from you and your skill set. Keep up the excellence my old friend.
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette
" What Me Worry"

Offline Borsos

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2452
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #35 on: August 13, 2016, 04:12:05 AM »
James, I only can echo that all: Very nice figures, I like them a lot! :)
"Deux armées aux prises, c'est une grande armée qui se suicide."
Barbusse.
"Ein Berg in Deutschland kann doch einen Berg in Frankreich nicht beleidigen. Oder ein Fluß oder ein Wald oder ein Weizenfeld."
Remarque.

Offline FarEast

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 443
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #36 on: August 13, 2016, 04:23:07 PM »
Right so after looking at uniforms I realized that I would need to also modify the sleeves of the jacket. I used simple masking tape for the sleeves and then some appropriate sized brass rod for the buttons.





After painting it up I applied the red piping and called it a day!!









So now all that needs doing is making the jig, harnesses and reins using the parts I picked up.


Offline gbrivio

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #37 on: August 13, 2016, 06:12:37 PM »
Every thing so far is really impressive, with accurate detailing and painting of vehicles and people around. How beautiful is goig to be the whole scene! I'm really longing to see the next steps.
Giuseppe

Offline Borsos

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2452
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #38 on: August 13, 2016, 10:38:22 PM »
James, just remember that German Airfield personnel in WWI wore black uniforms without piping!
Best wishes
Borsos
"Deux armées aux prises, c'est une grande armée qui se suicide."
Barbusse.
"Ein Berg in Deutschland kann doch einen Berg in Frankreich nicht beleidigen. Oder ein Fluß oder ein Wald oder ein Weizenfeld."
Remarque.

Offline malaula

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 213
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #39 on: August 13, 2016, 11:10:38 PM »
Yes,borsos is right,black working dress and black bands on the Feldmützen( or pork pie hats).That driver is clearly an infantry man.Don't mind James,this is no reson to change this wonderfully rendered figure in my oppinion,I think it would have been well possible that infantry helped out with personnel for transportation duties or else.
Well done ,James,I'm really lookin'forward on how you tackle Ron Kootje's conversion set!
best regards
Mathias

Offline FarEast

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 443
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #40 on: August 14, 2016, 07:45:45 AM »
James, just remember that German Airfield personnel in WWI wore black uniforms without piping!
Best wishes
Borsos

But he and like the other driver of the Marienfelde Lorry are not Airfield personnel - they would have been army personnel thus the uniform. (Same as the RFC/RAF - Drivers would have been assigned from the transport division or similar)

Also be very careful in your assumptions Borsos - Black fatigues were early war, they moved to field grey mid-late war and there are plenty of photographs showing a combination of black, Beige and Field Grey uniforms. If you go to the TVAL archive photos there are some wonderful photos of ground personnel in a whole range of colours and fatigues. Also if you scan through any of the Windsock Data Files on German bombers or observation aircraft you will come across a whole host of images showing ground personnel in different colours, uniforms etc. But by all accounts Jack Herris book G-Type Bombers has some incredible photos especaily of the Gotha G.V an G.VI bomber personnel in field grey.

Finally  the sculptors Andrey Blyoskin, Steve Warrilo, Martin Hille and other very talented and dedicated sculpters, all of who spend countless hours researching uniforms and colours have them painted in field grey fatigues .

Some other good photos are straight from the Wingnut Wings page - named them pic n mix for obvious reasons.







This is something that I had issues with before though Borsos in my last diorama and I contacted several experts in the field of WWI aviation they all came back that if you want to depict a realistic WWI German airfield then you need a mix of colours.

Thus why in my last diorama I have them in mixed uniforms.



Keep the critique coming though - It is very much appreciated as I come from a profession where we are constantly peer reviewing so in my search to back up my work I'm finding more interesting photos and information - however this has no led to more problems.

I found photos of a horses at an airfield - it's one of the comical photos were they are pulling an aircraft by horse and everyone has jumped on - the horse is in harness, being led by non airfield personnel but the horse is not blinkered, then I find another photo of a horse pulling a crashed B.II and its blinkered...... to blinker or not to blinker that is the question!








Offline coyotemagic

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7624
  • "Here's to not buggering it up." -Winston Chuchill
    • My Models
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #41 on: August 14, 2016, 12:33:39 PM »
Remarkable work on the figure and wagon, James.  This is going to be such a joy to watch.  The clash of eras is what I find so compelling about WWI, especially aviation.
Cheers,
Bud
"All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream in the dark recesses of the night awake in the day to find all was vanity. But the dreamers of day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, and make it possible." -T. E. Lawrence

Offline Borsos

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2452
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #42 on: August 14, 2016, 11:54:14 PM »
Hi James,
I love this exchange of Information and I dearly hope you don't mind my comments as your fantastic work itself is beyond any criticism  :) One of the reasons why I love this forum so much is that I can learn so much that I didn't know, because I didn't even think about asking. So I try to give my two cents where I think I could possibly give a hint.
The information I have on German aircrew uniforms are these:

I rely heavily on these Osprey books because as far as I can say they are very well researched. I never heared of black as early war dress and the exchange for field grey... But your post made me have a closer look at this book

It deals with German Army uniforms of WWI exhaustively and contains about 700 pages - but there's nothing in it dealing with the question of aircrew uniforms ... strange!

But the differnce in shade, especially when it comes to the very light jackets on your photos, is undoubtable. I just have another hypothesis: Next to their normal uniform every German soldier received working clothes, the so called drillichanzug. This was to be worn when it got dirty: For digging trenches, cleaning the barracks and other heavy work. This Drillichanzug was white or beige at the outbreack of the war. But that white working clothes were not the most clever idea was even realized at the German military bureaucracy and they started to dye these clothings field grey. That's the look of such a dyed Drillichjacke:

That's what I think the guys with the very light jackets are wearing, I think, on the Pic with the AEG bomber there are even the standing collars visible. And it would be logical: uparmouring a bomber plane is heavy work... So it's highly plausible, that due to shortages some went on wearing these light coloured (white/beige) Drillichjacken, some even wore their drillich trousers (which were threatened the same way) while maintaing aircraft or doing other heavy work behind the frontline. It is plausible as well that some aircrew received field grey uniforms due to shortages of black ones. But I think these differences between black or (field) grey on b/w photos of these times are very hard to review. I read some reports that frontline soldiers in the German army were recognizable from far away by their bleached uniforms, while the greenhorns still had their dark field grey ones. Clothing colors seem to jave faded quickly and I personally would take these shades as faded black - as I said, just my own interpretation.

by the way, your Walfisch ist just awesome too, I simply love the finish of this bird! And the question on blinked horses or not blinked horses .... pew... a very good one - maybe that depended on the anxiety of the horse...? ::)
"Deux armées aux prises, c'est une grande armée qui se suicide."
Barbusse.
"Ein Berg in Deutschland kann doch einen Berg in Frankreich nicht beleidigen. Oder ein Fluß oder ein Wald oder ein Weizenfeld."
Remarque.

Offline FarEast

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 443
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2016, 06:57:00 AM »
Yes the exchange in information is great - here is another photo I found of the natural "Drillich".... rather conspicuous and that was officially dyed to Field Grey later on in the war.



And the uniform that is on display at the Imperial War Museum..... 50 shades of grey ?







Going over the photos there is a huge array of uniform types of different shades - some clearly natural Drillich, some dyed, some heavily so, then as you point out dress uniform of every shade from obvious black to very light grey there is even a double breasted jacket in view being worn by rank and file. I used the above photos as the men are all in line and mostly in the open so the light source is the same and much more ideal for addressing this topic.

I take it the section you gave from Osprey Publishing German Air Forces 1914-18 is the only section on Ground Crew - if so that is a real shame? Could it be that the same happened with the Germans as it did the RNAS/RFC/RAF - that basically the change in uniform from Command was made yet personnel kept originals and the change was gradual rather than immediate - the change in fortunes for the Germans exasperating the difficulties in the change in uniform?

I think the only conclusion that can be made is to basically really mix up the shades and styles of the uniforms of the ground crews from black all the way through to almost white. Thankfully I'm yet to start on the Fliegertruppe ground crews........ The horses and limbers are almost done! Only a single set of reins remain to be attached - but working with 0.3mm masking tape is proving to be a little fiddly!
« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 07:17:11 AM by FarEast »

Offline Manni

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1555
    • Der Militärmodellbauer
Re: A night out with Erika - Gotha G.V 904/16 'Erika'
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2016, 03:05:27 PM »
Great, well painted figure makes me curious for all whats coming up.
Manni
"Ich hab' da mal was vorbereitet.": Jean Pütz
"Warum noch mehr Bausätze?!?": meine Frau