Author Topic: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)  (Read 4021 times)

Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2014, 02:08:08 AM »
This is going to be really interesting to follow as I've always wanted to try my hand at 3D illustration, but I have no experience with the programs. I have a good handle on vector drawing in CorelDraw and Illustrator as I've drawn four view AFV drawings for years in my spare time. Bear with me here as this isn't aircraft related, but if I was to add a fifth view to something like the following, would I be able to use this vector drawing to generate a 3D image of the vehicle?



Naturally, I'm thinking about doing the same with aircraft drawings too, if it's possible.

Cheers,

Chris
You can have it good; You can have it fast; you can have it cheap. Pick any two, but all three are impossible.

Offline IanB

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2014, 10:51:05 AM »
I'm beginning to understand what it must be like to speak a language other than English!
 I have no clue what you're talking about, but it's interesting anyway!  ???

Ian

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2014, 02:47:50 PM »
This is going to be really interesting to follow as I've always wanted to try my hand at 3D illustration, but I have no experience with the programs. I have a good handle on vector drawing in CorelDraw and Illustrator as I've drawn four view AFV drawings for years in my spare time. Bear with me here as this isn't aircraft related, but if I was to add a fifth view to something like the following, would I be able to use this vector drawing to generate a 3D image of the vehicle?



Naturally, I'm thinking about doing the same with aircraft drawings too, if it's possible.

Cheers,

Chris

Hi Chris nice to meet you.

Believe it or not I have come across your website in the past already a couple of times. I am a kind of blueprint fanatic so I often stumble on your technical drawing page whilst out searching for drawings :) I guess you also know George Bradford?

I admire your work, respect!

Let me know if you start with aircraft drawings if you take a break from Armored Fighting Vehicles.

Regards

Gary
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2014, 02:53:21 PM »
I'm beginning to understand what it must be like to speak a language other than English!
 I have no clue what you're talking about, but it's interesting anyway!  ???

Ian

Thanks Ian ...... I am trying to keep my descriptions as basic as possible. I'll try even harder now not to make it seem like a foreign language :)

And yep it is really interesting modelling in this way. Of course it doesn't replace traditional modelling, but I think once 3D printing becomes more and more widespread it will take a step closer. One large advantage I find is that I can take my modelling workplace with me where ever I go. I can model at home in my office, in the living room or kitchen, at work or even in my car if need be :) And I never need to wash my hands of paint afterwards.
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2014, 08:21:04 PM »
I guess you also know George Bradford?

Nice to meet you too Gary. George Bradford has been a good friend of mine for years. I think I was 16 when I first subscribed to his magazine and I'm 57 now, but prefer not to do the math.  ;D  It was with George's online tutelage that I taught myself to do scale drawings. Now if I could only transfer that skill set into 3D.

Cheers,

Chris
You can have it good; You can have it fast; you can have it cheap. Pick any two, but all three are impossible.

Offline Ernie

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2014, 08:46:25 PM »


Thanks Ian ...... I am trying to keep my descriptions as basic as possible. I'll try even harder now not to make it seem like a foreign language :)

And yep it is really interesting modelling in this way. Of course it doesn't replace traditional modelling, but I think once 3D printing becomes more and more widespread it will take a step closer. One large advantage I find is that I can take my modelling workplace with me where ever I go. I can model at home in my office, in the living room or kitchen, at work or even in my car if need be :) And I never need to wash my hands of paint afterwards.
[/quote]

Hi Gary,
  Foreign language or not, I am finding this absolutely fascinating.  Well done expanding your
pictures.  What a novel thought, taking your modelling with you...I cannot even imagine the
turmoil if I tried that with all my, for want of a better word, stuff. ;D
  I was wondering, when you complete an aeroplane, can it be used in a, or any flight simulator, or is
it not that type?  Thanks again for introducing this new world to me. 

Cheers,
Ernie :)
The new old guy, take two...

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2014, 03:16:20 AM »
I have a question for you experts out there. I have been working on the wheel axle and strut today and according to what reference material I could find, there is a main axle connecting the wheel which seems to be connected by a kind of locknut onto a thread on the end of the axle. There also seem to be two rods on either side of the axle which must be there to strengthen the struts and undercarriage assembly. I have attempted to model it as close as I can to what I saw in various photos, but a lot I had to improvise and kind of invent myself.

My question is this: In some photos I saw a kind of rope (sometimes a stretchy) which was tied around the axle and the two rods, in between the strut and the wheel. I would like to know if this has a use? Is it necessary? If so I will model it into my Spad as well. Awaiting some new knowledge from you specialists :)

Here is what I have modeled so far today on the axle area so you can see more what I mean.

Thank you!

Gary









Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2014, 03:42:51 AM »

Hi Gary,
  Foreign language or not, I am finding this absolutely fascinating.  Well done expanding your
pictures.  What a novel thought, taking your modelling with you...I cannot even imagine the
turmoil if I tried that with all my, for want of a better word, stuff. ;D
  I was wondering, when you complete an aeroplane, can it be used in a, or any flight simulator, or is
it not that type?  Thanks again for introducing this new world to me. 

Cheers,
Ernie :)

Hi Ernie. To answer your question I am not really sure, but I am guessing yes, it probably could be used in a flight simulator. I would probably have to largely reduce the polygon count or it might be too high resolution. Usually for games and such one has to keep the amount of detail to a minimum so that it loads quickly. I prefer to work on the heavy side, high resolution with lots of detail. The plane would probably also have to be rigged. Not "rigged" as you know it from traditional modeling. Rigging in 3D modeling is setting up the parts so they are moveable, like the propeller and flaps etc.
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline Ernie

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2014, 12:11:18 PM »
Hi Kiwiness.  Thanks for the answer to my question.  You were wondering about
the "rope" on the undercarriage.  It was a bungee cord, I think rubber wrapped
in cloth or canvas...not too sure about the wrapping.  Anyway, it was used as a
shock absorber and pretty well all WWI aeroplanes used on the axles in some way
or another, SPAD included.  Hope that helps a little.

Cheers,
Ernie :)
The new old guy, take two...

Offline vincentm

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #24 on: June 26, 2014, 07:20:44 AM »
Very nice, clean and precise work on the landing gear. I never felt comfortable with NURBS neither. Tools are not as user-friendly as for polygon modelling, and objects quickly get pretty heavy in terms of PC resources.

Quote
I never need to wash my hands of paint afterwards.
...and paints never dry up in the cans, and you never get short of any color as well...3D models don't break in a thousand pieces if you drop them, etc etc. And more-over, you can have them fly, burn or explode! And you even can fly them! ...but you can't touch them, that's the bad side.

About flying them: in flight sims, you can use LOD (level of detail) copies of a plane model. The game loads a very low poly version of your model when seen from a distance, and a more detailed version when seen from close. It also uses a high-resolution version of the cockpit for the plane you're flying, and a low-res version for the surrounding ones. This greatly helps saving resources. Also, textures are in compressed file formats like .dds which manages to handle a lot of information like color, bump, transparency, shininess etc.
I agree, maybe the most painful time you have when working on a model for video games, is the rigging. You need to set all axles at the correct place for every moving part to move properly, but also to individually set the X,Y and Z axis for every part. For instance, the Z axis must be inverted on ailerons if you want them to move 'one up and one down' when pushing the stick sideways.

I made only a few planes for flight sims, then I built cars for race sims. It's always been a great feeling to virtually 'take the wheel' of the cars I modelled.

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #25 on: July 02, 2014, 02:26:44 PM »
Hi Kiwiness.  Thanks for the answer to my question.  You were wondering about
the "rope" on the undercarriage.  It was a bungee cord, I think rubber wrapped
in cloth or canvas...not too sure about the wrapping.  Anyway, it was used as a
shock absorber and pretty well all WWI aeroplanes used on the axles in some way
or another, SPAD included.  Hope that helps a little.

Cheers,
Ernie :)

Hey Ernie

Thanks for that info, I was wondering what use that bungee cord had. Learning a lot here! I have to figure out how to model it now.
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2014, 02:31:32 PM »
Very nice, clean and precise work on the landing gear. I never felt comfortable with NURBS neither. Tools are not as user-friendly as for polygon modelling, and objects quickly get pretty heavy in terms of PC resources.

Quote
I never need to wash my hands of paint afterwards.
...and paints never dry up in the cans, and you never get short of any color as well...3D models don't break in a thousand pieces if you drop them, etc etc. And more-over, you can have them fly, burn or explode! And you even can fly them! ...but you can't touch them, that's the bad side.

About flying them: in flight sims, you can use LOD (level of detail) copies of a plane model. The game loads a very low poly version of your model when seen from a distance, and a more detailed version when seen from close. It also uses a high-resolution version of the cockpit for the plane you're flying, and a low-res version for the surrounding ones. This greatly helps saving resources. Also, textures are in compressed file formats like .dds which manages to handle a lot of information like color, bump, transparency, shininess etc.
I agree, maybe the most painful time you have when working on a model for video games, is the rigging. You need to set all axles at the correct place for every moving part to move properly, but also to individually set the X,Y and Z axis for every part. For instance, the Z axis must be inverted on ailerons if you want them to move 'one up and one down' when pushing the stick sideways.

I made only a few planes for flight sims, then I built cars for race sims. It's always been a great feeling to virtually 'take the wheel' of the cars I modelled.

Hey Vince, it seems you have excellent knowledge of the 3D world. I am glad I am not into 3D rigging and animation, it never really did interest me so much. And from what I have heard it is only a foundation for many headaches. It is all only a hobby for me so I'll stay away from the headache sector for now :) I love the modeling and texturing/painting as much as seeing the final product. As they say "getting there is half the fun". Are you still doing anything in the 3D world these days?
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline bobbberz

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #27 on: July 02, 2014, 02:33:25 PM »
I have been terribly busy at work the last week and haven't had a chance to continue on my project. But last night I managed to get a bit more done, I will try to post my progress this evening or tomorrow morning. I am stuck on the propeller at the moment. It is not as easy to model as I had imagined. I will have to try a different method.
Beware of the hun in the sun!

Offline vincentm

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Re: Spad XIII CGI Project (WIP)
« Reply #28 on: July 03, 2014, 10:29:38 AM »
You are quite right: setting up a 3D model for animation or for video game import is a pain. But when you realize that you'll be able to fly or drive your own model, it really becomes addictive. I worked for a while in a small video game company, we were building race cars for video games (rFactor) and for VIP simulators that are used on race tracks. In my opinion, the drawback is that every model you build becomes obsolete after 2 or 3 years, which means you have to constantly redo what you've already done. It's even more painstaking, to say the truth. Anyway, the company failed after 3 or 4 years and we didn't earn much meanwhile. Then I became a "simple gamer", being part of a combat flight sim squad for a few years. Only thing I did during this period was painting skins for my personal mounts...

Sometimes I'd love to re-install the games I used to work on, just to have fun driving "my" cars, but I'm glad I came back to building models. I sometimes have fun animating 3D characters in 3dsmax, but that's all.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 10:33:39 AM by vincentm »