Author Topic: Buying land for an airfield  (Read 2665 times)

Offline Des

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Buying land for an airfield
« on: September 06, 2013, 12:41:08 PM »
This subject was posted in another topic and was off topic so I have started a new topic here, this is from David.


I'm actually thinking about buying some land in Northern New South Wales.  Land is cheap there and the weather is much more like what you would expect it to be in Australia.  If I get the current market value for my house, not that I would sell it, I would prefer to borrow against it, I could buy two 1,800 acre properties!  Presumably I could also buy a single 3,600 acre property, but I haven't heard of any this size yet.  Plenty of space for an airfield on a property of that size! 

Regards,

David.
Late Founder of ww1aircraftmodels.com and forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com

Offline Des

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Re: Buying land for an airfield
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2013, 12:44:36 PM »
Posted by Ernie Parsons


...Airfield??? I like the way you think, David! ;D 
Good luck with the land purchase, and remember,
no paved runways. ;)

Cheers,
Ernie :)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 12:48:03 PM by Des »
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Offline Des

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Re: Buying land for an airfield
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2013, 12:46:05 PM »

Posted by David

Yes, that's right, you heard (read actually!  ) correctly!  I started off as a model builder nearly 30 years ago (1984) and built a scale model of a Sopwith one and a half strutter.  It is a stand off scale model (1:8 scale) and flies like a dog but it looks absolutely magnificent in the air!  On a VERY calm day it flies quite well but as soon as it gets a hint of a current, thermal or breath of wind it can be almost uncontrollable.  Given that comparison of the model to photographs of Sopwith strutters revealed just how "stand off" it really is, I became interested in the structure, colours and markings applicable to the original aeroplanes.  Later that year I started building quite an accurate (in appearance) SE5a model.  I very quickly realised that it too was stand off scale, at least in my opinion, and I scrapped it and started again early in 1985 from memory.  The resulting model is probably the most accurate model built at that time, although the standard has improved enormously since then.  I had an advanced case of AMS before I knew what AMS was! (AAMS???  )  In 1985 I also saw a DH9 fuselage at the Phillips Skyfest here in Canberra.  I talked to the guys who were there to show it to the public.  It turned out that it is an original DH9 and that it was in the process of being restored.  Many of the restorers also worked on the Pfalz D.XII restoration in the late 1960's and early 1970's.  I joined the restoration team in 1986 and learned a lot about the DH9 and WW1 aeroplane structures during the next few years.  I also gained a feeling for what it would be like to build a full sized replica.  In 1987 a drunk driver crashed through the shed and broke the fuselage into three large pieces, and absolutely shattered some components.  It was a huge mess but we rebuilt it and now you would never know that it was so badly damaged at one time.  As a 19 year old - from memory it was a couple of years until we were ready to rebuild the fuselage - I convinced the much older and more experienced restoration team members to rebuild the fuselage authentically.  One of the ideas put forward was to make small cuts on the inside of the longerons, which although common joinery practice was not authentic, and is considerably weaker than the original construction method.  Although this DH9 will never fly again I managed to convince the team leader that the original method of steaming the rear longerons in order to bend them was far more appropriate.  It was not difficult, although it did take quite some time to saturate the timber - which I believe to have been of a far inferior quality to the original - to the point where it would bend easily.  I tried to ensure that we used as much of the original longeron fragments as possible, but I was not as successful in this case.  The lower longerons were completely replaced and the upper longerons were spliced into the original longerons just forward of the leading edge of the tailplane.

Since this experience I started to measure propellers, pieces of aeroplanes etc and collect aeroplane drawings when I could find them.  I now have drawings for about 13 or 14 different types of aeroplanes, and am currently investigating the production of replica engines.  I am not a qualified engineer, so I could be wrong but my estimate is that a typical aeroplane engine would cost approximately $190,000.  During discussions with a world renowned WW1 aeroplane engine builder this ballpark figure was confirmed.  I can see why most replica builders choose to use a modern alternative engine.  Still, I have always wanted to build replicas and if I don't start now I never will!  It's a lot of work and it's important to start at a reasonable age, so that I'm not test flying a type when I'm 90!

A few years ago I started to get stress related migraines, and as therapy I helped a friend of mine to build an airfield.  As you said, no paved runways!  I think the plan is to pave one of them but he is going to leave the other one as a grass strip.  If and when I buy some land it will be an airfield as opposed to an airstrip, and it will definitely not be paved!  It will be dead flat, as most if not all WW1 airfields were and I would like to construct some buildings if possible to make it really look the part.  That's all dreaming at this stage, since I am starting to realise not only how time consuming but how expensive it is to build replicas to original specifications.  Another potential stumbling block is the issue of licences to build the engines.  It seems that if the company still exists it is necessary to purchase a licence to build the engine from the company.  Perhaps this only applies if their engine drawings are used, I am not sure.  I don't think, for example that there would be a problem building a replica Oberursal U.R.II but most of my research has been on various Albatros models, so this could be a problem.  I will have to try to find out, or try to find an original engine, although there aren't many available and I would prefer to see all original engines in museums or private collections, not flying where they will eventually wear out and might be destroyed in a crash.

Regards,

David.
Late Founder of ww1aircraftmodels.com and forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com

Offline David

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Re: Buying land for an airfield
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2013, 04:05:57 AM »
Thanks for starting this thread Des.  I saw a brief comment and was stressing about it all afternoon, then fell asleep and only just woke up not long ago.  It's very early and I've got another big day coming up so I will be busy again.  I was going to call you and ask you what to do, then later I thought that I would send it to Lance in a private message (was it Lance I was replying to?).  This is even better!  I was very surprised when I found out how cheap land is up there.  My sister already lives up there and my Mum also wants to move up that way.  I came to the same conclusion independently, so we will see what happens.  I have recently been made aware that there are some similar sized blocks down this way for comparable prices, so I might stay in the area yet.  One advantage of Northern N.S.W. is the warm weather, and it's close to The Australian Vintage Aviation Society.  I am very keen to be actively involved in bringing their aeroplanes to flying condition, and they are keen for me to help too!  It's at least a 12 or 13 hour drive from here, so I really need somewhere much closer to use as a base.  It doesn't have to be large but I would have to admit that with the relatively cheap land, buying a property I could put an airfield on, and which is close to TAVAS is VERY tempting!  ;D

Offline LindsayT

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Re: Buying land for an airfield
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2013, 05:01:36 AM »
There is a guy in the States that built a replica Camel from a kit using modern materials, but it has a lot of original instruments. The build log was posted on The Aerodrome and is a fascinating read:

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/replica-aircraft/43868-airdrome-f-1-camel.html

He wasn't satisfied with the radial engine he had hanging off the front - which is beautiful by the way - so he commissioned the building of a Gnome 100 from a shop in New Zealand. Much less than $190k:

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/replica-aircraft/57967-running-gnome-100-a.html

Anyway, the relevant point here is that he is currently building his own replica aerodrome in Ohio, complete with period hangar, Officer's Mess, and period French house:

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/replica-aircraft/57588-replica-aerodrome-part-deux.html

All well worth the read,

LT

Offline David

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Re: Buying land for an airfield
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2013, 05:17:11 AM »
Hi Lindsay,

I haven't clicked on the links but I am sure that is Russ Turner's Camel.  I remember reading his posts recently with great interest!  It's absolutely fantastic that he has commissioned a 100 HP Gnome, and that he has build his airfield, complete with buildings!  I like the way he has done it.  He has gone to the trouble of making his aeroplane and his airfield as authentic as possible.  A very commendable effort!

Thank you very much for posting the links!