1/72 Short S 80

[lone modeller]

Thank you Nigel, Paul and enathan for the comments - they are much appreciated.

Paul: "making stuff up as you go along" is a good definition of scratch building! I do it all the time!!

I am currently trying to fix the floats to the fuselage and had forgotten how to do it....so I am now on the third attempt and I think that I have cracked it at last> I will find out if I have later on this evening....or not!!

Stephen.

[lone modeller]

Evening All,

As indicted in the last post I rigged the booms and wings and added the remaining struts to the assembly. The rudders were fixed in place and control horns added to them and the horizontal stabilizer so that the control wires could be added.

Fixing the floats should have been straightforward, but because I did not think things through properly I made it harder than it should have been. I started by putting on the two bars that hold the struts horizontally. I then tried to put the struts into the floats and when these had nearly set, offered them to the fuselage: I had forgotten that when trying to attach struts to a model it is a good idea if you can see the ends of the struts and the holes that you want them to fit into?. Having proved that that method does not work, I removed the struts from the floats and put them into the fuselage instead. When thy were almost dry I attached the float assembly with very little difficulty?..!  This assembly had to be supported while it hardened overnight, using one of my sophisticated jigs:









With the floats in place I could proceed to finish most of the remaining rigging, including the control wires to the ailerons. The front elevator was attached to the supports which I made from 25 thou rod. The tail floats and anti-drag wires completed the model:







Now that the aircraft is finished I will start to make the base for it. This will be based on a photograph of the aircraft on the River Nile at Cairo in February 1914.

Thanks for looking.

Stephen.

[DaddyO]

WOW!
That's a great scratchbuilding effort Stephen and a fabulous end result. Really interesting aircraft to add to your collection 

Thanks for sharing the build process along the way. Learning lots and its great to hear that I'm not alone in forgetting stuff that I've already learned and working things out as you go.
Paul

[NigelR]

An amazing scratchbuild Stephen, the finished model looks fantastic. And what an interesting aircraft!

[DaveB]

Amazing work as ever, Steve and can only echo what Paul and Nigel have already said .....

Love your sophisticated paint pot jig!!

Regards

Dave

[lone modeller]

Evening All,

Thank you gentlemen for the kind comments - they are much appreciated, the more so in the light of what I am about to report.

I have been struggling with rather a lot recently, so modelling slowed to a crawl and then what I think is a minor disaster happened.

I want to put the S 80 on to a base to represent the launch of the aircraft on to River Nile at Cairo in January 1914. I have a photograph which I am using as a basis for the vignette. I made up a base from hardboard and glued some extra layers in one corner. I covered the hardboard corner with filler and sanded it too rigorously so I had to add a second layer and tried to add a little variation, but not too much as it is a river bank and therefore almost level. The bank was painted with multiple thin coats of acrylic to represent the very dark silts which make up the flood plain of the River Nile:



The bottom of the river was painted Revell acrylic ultramarine blue (51). I know the blue is very dark but I intended to add some lighter blue to the resin which would represent sky reflected in the water. So far so good.

I had watched several videos on different products which can be used to represent water and I chose to use AK Resin Water (AK8044) - a two part epoxy to which I could add some colouring from more acrylics. I made a small amount as a test piece and left it to harden for 24 hours and got a good result, so I decided to have a go on the real thing. I thought at first that I would make two batches of resin: make and pour one, let it harden and the repeat with a second batch. However I managed to overdo the first batch and decided on the spur of the moment to make all of the material and pour it in one go. I added what I thought would be enough colouring and poured.

Although the resin hardened it remained slightly sticky on the surface for nearly 4 days, but even worse was to follow. I had not added nearly enough colour so the very dark blue undersurface shows through. In addition over a period of about three weeks, the surface of the resin has crinkled in several places:







Where the surface of the resin has split, the exposed resin is slightly sticky again. I had intended to add another thin layer of transparent acrylic water gel to represent wavelets and ripples on the river surface, but I am now seriously thinking of removing the upper part of the model (fuselage, wings, etc) from the floats and making up a new float undercarriage. I can then make a new base and start again. But before I do so I need to know why the resin has reacted as it has. Does anyone have any experience with resin water or can make suggestions as to what I have done incorrectly. Has the resin reacted in this way because I added thinned acrylic paint to the mixture? If so could I add thinned enamel paint instead?

Any help/suggestions would be most welcome.

Stephen.

[DaddyO]

 
Ah Bugger. That's a real downer Stephen. As you suggest salvaging the model sans floats looks to be the best option at this stage.

The tackiness is almost certainly down to the resin not drying because it is too thick, but I've no experience of that particular resin so it may be another cause. I know Nigel had a number of issues when making a deep shell hole filled with water so perhaps he will chip in with suggestions.

Hopefully you'll get it sorted out
Paul

[NigelR]

I posted some thoughts on your other thread based on my experiences is using resin water in three dioramas. The resin can react with what you mix with it, but definitely don't put enamels in. AFAIK acrylic is the way to go.

I suspect your main problem here stems from not putting a gloss sealing layer over the base. You need an impermeable finish under the resin. I always paint the the AK one-part liquid water over the base prior to any pour.  I suspect the cracking/rippling problem is due to uneven drying caused by the lack of a gloss layer on the base. Also, the deeper the pour, the higher the chance of issues because there is more resin to dry out in one go.

I had a similar but less pronounced issue in my most recent diorama. I used AK two-part, built up the pour in layers and initially it looked fine but after a few weeks there were some swirls and imperfections appearing in the surface together with a small spilt in one area (never had this before). So I covered the imperfections with ripples made from AK Water Effects gel.

Before you take the plane off, you could see if you can salvage it with AK Water Effects gel. This will build up the ripples you desired and will to some degree hide what is underneath. If there is space for another pour of a thin layer of two-part resin, this may fill the gaps before you put the ripples on top. 

If you do use the AK Water Effects for ripples, practice on test pieces first. It takes some practice to get the technique right - look at Night Shift's videos on YouTube where he makes dioramas with water in them. I cocked it up on my first attempt. The most important lesson I learned was to build it up in layers, don't try to get the effect you want in one go.

This diorama uses the AK Water Effects to create a nice ripple effect (after I had to cover up my first failed attempt with another layer of resin....):

[lone modeller]

Many thanks Paul and Nigel for your comments.

Nigel: I did not put in a waterproof base so that is almost certainly the cause of the problem. Thank you too for explaining the use of the Acrylic gel for ripples - I have already looked at Night Shift videos and was using them as a guide - his work really is very good (as is yours by the way).

I have decided that I will make a new base - provided that I can remove the aircraft from the floats.... and use the existing one to practice the ripple effects that I want to achieve on the completed model. This is a setback but one advantage of scratchbuilding is that it is relatively easy to replace parts - a pair of floats and some struts should not be a problem. The finished model is destined for Eastchurch so I do want to try to get it right if I can, and I am happy to pay the price of learning a new technique.

Watch this space and hopefully the next post will be more successful.

Stephen.

[Dirigible-Al]

A quick fix from this would be to crunch up some baking foil, then flatten it out. Stick this to the base, paint with white glue, paint with light green then put multiple thin washes of blue over it until you are happy with the look.  Finish off with many, many coats of high gloss. You will not get the lovely 'see slightly below the surface' effect but I think that at 1/72 you could get away with this.
Alan.

[NigelR]

I have decided that I will make a new base - provided that I can remove the aircraft from the floats.... and use the existing one to practice the ripple effects that I want to achieve on the completed model. This is a setback but one advantage of scratchbuilding is that it is relatively easy to replace parts - a pair of floats and some struts should not be a problem. The finished model is destined for Eastchurch so I do want to try to get it right if I can, and I am happy to pay the price of learning a new technique.

I think that's a good idea, it will be worth the effort. It doesn't look too challenging to remove the aircraft from the floats.

I use these Woodland Scenics Water Tints for colouring my resin: https://woodlandscenics.woodlandscenics.com/show/item/WSWT . I've only used the muddy ones but they give a somewhat muted finish. As you found, acrylic colours can be a bit intense because they are highly pigmented.

Here's a couple more tips:

- When you work with the AK Water Effects gel, work in relatively small areas. Don't cover the whole base in the gel and then try to put the ripples in, because it will have started to go off in some areas by the time you get to them and you can't work it properly. And working in layers is key.

- Don't try to get the colour just from the resin. Paint the base in such a way that it has the main colours you need to create your seascape. You can also use this to create an illusion of depth even before the resin is poured, which means you don't have to put so much colour in the resin itself. So paint the areas closer to the jetty a lighter bule green and the areas further away a slightly darker colour. And introduce a bit of variation, that gives an impression of movement in the water itself. And tne make sure it is completely dry and thoroughly sealed before you pour the resin.

Here's a photo of the diorama above before I poured the resin. The shellhole looks deeper than it is because the centre is painted a very dark colour but I then used lighter colours towards the edges. I then poured layers of decreasingly tinted resin to create a nice impression of a deep, murky shellhole. Sadly I then screwed up the ripples with the AK gel (see tip above!) so had to cover the whole thing in a layer of heavily tinted resin to cover up the cockup. The result (above) isn't what I wanted but it's ok.

[DaddyO]

Another suggestion for you Stephen
(I was reminded by Alan's post earlier that I'd made up a 'sea base' for a figure about 15 years ago)

Anyway the method I used was to sculpt the sea in Miliput which I think I built in layers; first one got a rough shape and subsequent ones refined the waves. Once dry this was painted in acrylics being quite rough in application, but deeper in the shadows and lighter towards the crests. Several layers of artists gloss medium were then painted on (keep it covered up to avoid any dust motes getting into it) I've never had any issues with gloss medium drying strangely because it's designed for artists to apply to finished paintings and you can imagine the uproar if it was 'tricky'
Finally the white crests were painted again in acrylic. For 'foam' you can stipple the very crests and even add some gesso if you need more texture (probably not in 1/72)

On this one I also added barnacles using tank 'texture' powder which I think is used for simulating rough armour plate, but the medium texture one was ideal for this. The seaweed is thick artists acrylic

The figure, incidentally, is an Andrea one approximately 1/32 

sea 2 by Paul S, on Flickr

Nelson on base by Paul S, on Flickr

[Skyhook]

Oh, that water surface is a setback for sure; come to think of it, how about modelling some reeds or other plantlife of waterline over the bad bits? I am sure that might look actually good. Or some kind of a raft or a boat? Even trying to make there foam and waves might be the cure? Oh, I notice that it has been suggested above, but gets my vote too

Cheers, skyhook.

[lone modeller]

Evening All,

After what has been for me a horrible late winter and early spring, (dull wet days, short daylight hours, and some life issues), in the past couple of weeks things have really perked up and my modelling mojo has returned. My last post reflected how I was feeling at the time - not very positive! How a couple of weeks of bright sunshine, warmer spring weather and longer days can rejuvenate an ageing model maker!

Many thanks Nigel, Paul and Skyhook for the very helpful comments: they both helped to motivate me to have another try and offered some very useful tips which as you will see I incorporated in my latest attempt.

I made a new base for the S 80 and took some advice from other modellers who have used resin effects water. I made the river bank as before - gypsum plaster over a hardwood base, but this time I followed Nigel's advice and sealed the edges and bottom of the base with water effects resin after I had painted it blue. I poured the resin in two layers, each approximately 2mm thick, rather than a single 4mm thick layer. I also used Woodland Scenics water tints, (a mixture of turquoise and navy blue), for colouring. The resin still took several days to harden and there was a very small amount of cracking of the surface, but this time it did not matter because I applied AK water gel effects to make small wavelets on the surface and these obliterated all of the minor irregularities on the resin. I sharpened a mixing stick and scooped a small amount of gel and drew the stick over the resin surface, wriggling it slightly as I did so to give an irregular pattern:



Other modellers have suggested using an old paintbrush to apply the gel, but I think that the results speak for themselves:





I have based my scene on a photograph taken on 3 January 1914 which showed the S 80 shortly after launch on the River Nile at Cairo, where F. McClean, A. Ogivily, H. Short and G. Smith are on or around the aircraft and others are man-handling the tail while standing on the river bank. A fellow modeller gave me some figures from a railway set and I used those for my scene - they do not exactly replicate the figures in the photo but they do act as a scale and they have been set to represent the scene:



Now that at last this model is finished I can start on another project for the two seater GB, and hopefully pick up the Parnall Peto which has been stalled for too long. That will be after the Easter break as a family visit is looming and there is much to do.

I will post more pictures and some history of McClean's 1914 expedition on the River Nile in the aircraft section shortly.

Thanks for looking.

Stephen.

[NigelR]

Well done Stephen, you saved it! The end result looks great, I really like the ripple effect you created, it looks very effective. Well done again, you've created a unique model of a very interesting episode.