Author Topic: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?  (Read 285 times)

Offline erikr

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Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« on: March 30, 2020, 10:18:02 PM »
Hello everybody!

I want to build a model of Aloy Heldmann's Pfalz which has a serial number of 4117/17.  Decal references says its a D.IIIa but the D.IIIa prototype was 4165/17 so I assume that his plane was built before the prototype.  Wouldn't that make Heldmann's plane a D.III or did Pfalz sometimes build them out of order?  I can't find a photo of the plane to check.  Does anyone out there know for sure it was a D.III or D.IIIa?  Any help in this matter would be appreciated!

Thanks,
ErikR

Offline RAGIII

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2020, 11:52:54 PM »
I am checking My references. So far the Osprey Pfalz Aces book says DIIIa. I will continue to look.
RAGIII
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Offline RAGIII

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #2 on: March 31, 2020, 12:10:05 AM »
After further review, and thought, I am pretty certain that 4117/17 was a DIII. According to the Data file on the DIII production of the DIIIa started @ 4189/17. I also recall looking into this Myself now. If I recall correctly the text in the Pfalz aces book mentioned Heldman flying DIII D4117/17 and the Profile said DIIIa. I now recall asking about this Myself either here or on the Drome and the answer was DIII. I hope this helps.
RAGIII
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Offline AndRoby67

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2020, 12:17:23 AM »
I think there is some confusion, your doubt is good.
For Osprey (and Pheon Decal) is a D.IIIa, in Aerodrome is a D.III.
I've never seen a photo of the original one.
Roberto

Offline RAGIII

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2020, 12:30:21 AM »
I think there is some confusion, your doubt is good.
For Osprey (and Pheon Decal) is a D.IIIa, in Aerodrome is a D.III.
I've never seen a photo of the original one.
Roberto

I don't know if their is a photo of the original. I think the Profile in the Osprey book  was based on an interview with Heldmann.
RAGIII
« Last Edit: March 31, 2020, 12:42:49 AM by RAGIII »
"A man has to know his limitations": Harry Callahan

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Offline erikr

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2020, 09:37:16 PM »
Thank you all very much!

I also found out that he flew another Pfalz, a camouflaged D.III, 1395/17.

Offline RAGIII

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2020, 10:46:23 PM »
Thank you all very much!

I also found out that he flew another Pfalz, a camouflaged D.III, 1395/17.

Yes, an early DIII with Camo  8) There is at least a partial photo of that one.
RAGIII
"A man has to know his limitations": Harry Callahan

"Don't slop it on" Lynda Geisler

Offline AndRoby67

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Re: Heldmann's Pfalz 4117/17 - Was it a D.III or D.IIIa?
« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2020, 12:15:48 AM »
Hi!
I check also in "Pfalz Aircraft of WWI" by Jack Herris but no trace of a photo of yours.
There is a photo of 4114/17, clearly a D.III.
Roberto