Author Topic: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben  (Read 20440 times)

Online ondra

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #105 on: December 28, 2016, 05:23:19 AM »
Hi Jeroen,

you spotted the issue correctly and Justin is right as to the correction. The lower wings had a slight dihedral. Once you correct that, your Albie should be all fine.

Great job so far, looking forward to further progress!

Cheers

Ondra

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #106 on: December 28, 2016, 05:27:00 AM »
wow, that  was quick! :)

Here's a quick head-on shot... I did add dihedral, but apparently not enough?

Those Roden wings are very flexible indeed, so a bit of bending might help (or snap them off :P )

Offline uncletony

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #107 on: December 28, 2016, 05:30:58 AM »
dihedral looks ok to me -- it's not much on actual D.V/a

and the gap between top of fuselage/greasy bits and upper wing is not much, either -- yours looks ok to me judging purely by mk 1 eyeball

Online ondra

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #108 on: December 28, 2016, 05:53:24 AM »
Ok, I think I see the problem now. Thanks for the new picture.

Based on that photo, I would say that the issue is not the dihedral. It rather looks like a problem with the length of the rear interplane strut - should actually be longer. Now the upper wing is in a different angle to the horizontal axis than the lower. Probably this causes the problem of the upper wing looking like sitting too close to the fuselage (the trailing edge of the wing is too close to the cockpit coaming).

Ondra

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #109 on: December 28, 2016, 06:32:43 AM »
Thanks, Bo and Ondra :)
The Roden wings are very flexible so they will take a bit of extra dehidral. Though, looking at the Wingnut Wings side profiles the upper wing seems to be at nearly the same level of the windshield too...

Picture found on Hyperscale from James Fahey.

Unfortunately, the struts are fixed already with Revell Contacta so won't come off easily. Part of the problem may also be the gun, it won't go deeper (and I fixed the engine already lower) and still seems to sit too high. That also creates a bit of an optical narrow gap.
I'll sleep a night over it; thanks for your opinions and carpenter's eyes :)

Jeroen

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #110 on: December 29, 2016, 02:29:22 AM »
After looking again a few times I think Ondra has found the culprit.... the rear part of the V struts seem too short. When I dryfitted the cabane struts they would not line up unless I tilted the wing backwards even more.
I'm afraid they'll have to come off...

Thanks again for th ideas! :)

Offline Borsos

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #111 on: December 29, 2016, 05:28:47 AM »
How sad is this misshap! I think I wouldn't have noticed the upper wing sitting too low in this very case. Can I help out with some scans of the eduard 1/72 Albatros D V struts? I once build one or two and as far as I remember the struts were fine.
Borsos
"Deux armées aux prises, c'est une grande armée qui se suicide."
Barbusse.
"Ein Berg in Deutschland kann doch einen Berg in Frankreich nicht beleidigen. Oder ein Fluß oder ein Wald oder ein Weizenfeld."
Remarque.

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #112 on: December 29, 2016, 06:50:16 AM »
Hi Borsos,

Thanks for the offer! :)
If you can scan the interplane and cabane struts (or measure them up if that's easier),  I may make some final corrections as I had a productive evening modelling fixing this...

I removed (as in, snapped off) the struts, added stretched sprue rods to lengthen (that Wingnut Wings plastic is a keeper for this!) and drilled out the snapped off parts from the locating holes.
Superglue, sanding, blending, breaking, cursing, patience, measuring, etc etc.........:



One other side-effect of lengthening the rear part of the V-struts is that the lower wing now sits in the middle of the upper one as it should be:

And the cabane struts, while off lengthwise, will now at least come close to the holes instead of ending up 1mm away from them when viewed from the sides. They also all line up now.
The gap seems a bit too much at the moment, but making it smaller is always easier, and the stuts just sit there not glued but with some poster-buddy sticky stuff (similar to Blue-Tack) so they aren't fully seated in their holes yet. I'm also very curious as to how they match up to Eduard's from Borsos' kit :)

Thanks for the support and ideas so far, I was inclined to leave it like it was but I'd be sure it would always bug me when looking at the model.

Happier now,
Jeroen

Online RAGIII

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #113 on: December 30, 2016, 09:40:57 PM »
You have an extraordinary will to get this correct! I would have given up long ago  :-[ I think you are on the right track now!
RAGIII
"A man has to know his limitations": Harry Callahan

"Don't slop it on" Lynda Geisler

Offline uncletony

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #114 on: December 30, 2016, 10:43:22 PM »

If you can scan the interplane and cabane struts (or measure them up if that's easier), 

keep i mind the cabane struts are not planar -- though in 1/72 it won't be by much. Viewed head-on, the forward struts are at a different angle relative to the fuselage than the two in the rear


Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #115 on: December 31, 2016, 06:20:50 AM »
RAGIII; thanks for the support -when you teach your kids persistance, I have to show some of it myself, don't I... sometimes I do wish I'd give up easier or take easier way out. But I guess that's how I am and my collegues all the more appriciate that trait if some ICT thingie has a problem :)

Bo; thanks for the reminder, I remember now from my D.III Öffag. I have, in the meanwhile, received the scans from Borsos and have adjusted accordingly -with a bit of extra added. Always easier to shorten something a bit.

Those scans at least give me a rough approximation; a bit of fine tuning will probably be needed anyway. Judging by previous Roden kits I would not be surprised if one fuselage half is a tiny bit different from the other, too! :)

Hopefully some painting tomorrow, I'll definately need new superglue. The one I have now takes ages to dry and is kind of thick. Great for strut modifications, though!

Jeroen

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #116 on: January 02, 2017, 07:04:54 AM »
getting there... took me 2 evenings of sanding, filling, breaking them (again), fitting again, taking a bit more off... etc.

Printing the scans from Borsos and matching the interplane struts showed mine were a hair longer -as in, if I were to dril the holes a bit deeper, they'd be the same length.
The cabane struts were lengthened earlier and matched to the scans, too. I made them a bit longer, and after a dryfit it all appeared to come together, if not too long as of yesterday evening:


I have since shortened them a bit more, but more helpful was actually drilling the holes in the fuselage to 0,9mm size so I could push the lower sides into them as deep as required. This seems to work; and they fit quite well now, but the pictures I took were unusable.
One thing I learned is that lengthening struts by about 1mm is difficult, as the little end tends to break off easiliy. With hingsight it would have been better to cut some 4-5mm off, and repair that so the vulnerable outer ends don't break so easy.

Anyway, they're finally ready for the paint shop for a coat of primer and red. I will also paint the Spandau then, so I can finally start thinking about getting the whole thing together!

Jeroen

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #117 on: February 22, 2017, 06:54:41 AM »
Well... it's been a while, and while I haven't spent a lot of time on modelling, I still managed to get some of those little things done that finally seem to come together. Hopefully I'll be able to participate some more in here too, I had to dig the thread from page 3 so I have a lot of reading to do!

Little stuff:

Wheels (obviously), 2 flare guns modified from Roden Parebellum type MGs, probably wholly inaccurate, but both machines had them fitted on the top wing. I also made a mirror for the Albatros (not pictured), and the grey tube with rods will be an Oigee sight. The final little black thing that I hope is recognizable is the anemometer for the Fokker. It still needs to have the dial painted, but is so tiny it'll probably be easier to paint when it is attached!

This is how the Fokker currently looks. Not much different from before, but I added a host of small details, like fixing the radiator filler cap, replaced the broken control horns on the top wing (of course they're not aligned top to bottom... :-( ), added the forgotten tail skid, touched up the green where it had flaked off somewhat (due to the handling) with both carefully mixed paint and decals, and so on... When the paints and glue have dried I can slowly start thinking about final rigging and assembly.


(I really should have dusted the model off...)

Then there's troublesome Albatros. I finally fixed up the struts and managed to glue to top wing on. I'll spare the details and language, but it is on, and one of the cabane struts snapped out of it's locating hole, which I missed, so it's slightly crooked. Or, as Bo pointed out, it should be crooked, but on the right side is perfectly aligned now. I also managed to put a drop of CA glue straigt on the engine cowling panel :-( Just my luck with this model!
Before that, I fitted the new machine gun I got from Malaula (Mathias) and the panel that goes in between. I have also painted the access panels on the lower wing, and noticed that one of the aileron actuator arms is gone. I don't know how, since it's almost buried in the wing cutout, but it's gone nonetheless. Should be easy to fashion a new one, though.
Some detail painting and touch ups on the struts later, I got this on my bench:


Even though my perfectionist self doens't like the crooked strut, my other perfectionist half is happy that the wing now has the proper height as far as I can tell, and also sits square and straight. Sometimes it helps to think at how it looked first, with the too-high engine requiring surgery and the mess with the struts.
After a few weeks it's easy to forget that :-)

Anyway, rant over, I had fun doing the detailing stuff, feels nice to be able to move on instead of constantly needing to fiddle with unwilling stuff that only worsens the result. They'll never be IPMS contest winners, but I'm happy with them anyway. Comments and critique welcome!

Jeroen

Online RAGIII

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #118 on: February 22, 2017, 07:27:04 AM »
Nice to see you back on these two! I am happy to see that you have the Albie wing sorted out! It looks good now. The DVII is also coming along nicely! I am looking forward to your next update.
RAGIII
"A man has to know his limitations": Harry Callahan

"Don't slop it on" Lynda Geisler

Offline jeroen_R90S

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Re: Roden 1/72 Fokker D.VII (OAW) and Albatros D.Va -> Jasta Raben
« Reply #119 on: February 22, 2017, 09:51:53 PM »
Thanks! :) Hopefully I'll be able to make some progress this week, my wife works evening/night shifts and after the kids are in bed I've got the evening all for myself. Some good music and a dark beer should help ;)
I hear a WNW D.VII wanting attention...

Jeroen