forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Hints and Tips/Questions about modeling => Topic started by: Silver wings on February 06, 2017, 01:48:58 AM
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Hi all,
I bought a Vertigo jig for wing alignment. It arrived in a flat cardboard envelope to be put together like a jigsaw puzzle. The shaft for the wing extension is too narrow to accept a bolt. The rest of the shafts are fine. Is this normal for this tool? The other question is (What do you do with it) There are no instructions for it's use. Is this another stupid purchase on my part. Any help would be appreciated.
Thank you,
Alec
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Hi Alec, sorry not heard of these but a quick Google search brings up this page http://www.vertigo-miniatures.com/vertigo/eshop/15-1-VERTIGO-JIGS (http://www.vertigo-miniatures.com/vertigo/eshop/15-1-VERTIGO-JIGS)
Looks like there are several different types of jig from these people, assuming these are the ones.
Clicking on any photos at the bottom of the page takes you to an individual product page with several more photos. These may help you. Failing that email Vertigo, email address is on the Contact page.
Hope this helps a bit!
H
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Following H's link I realized that my jig that I bought about a year or so ago was from Vertigo too. I built it up with CA and it still does its job very well. If I can help you out with pics of my version of the jig, just let me know!
Borsos
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not 100% sure what you mean by wing shaft extension but all bolts should fit through the appropriate acrylic pieces. I find it pretty handy...
(http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj150/petrov27/005_zpsdnsiowxk.jpg)
(http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj150/petrov27/007_zpsqywkaymw.jpg)
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Nice AEG! Show us more!
Thanks! Ha this is my old stalled build here:
http://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=5297.0
had some major challenges with decals and with adding aftermarket to the engines but finally have it out on the bench again and addressing issues. Flat coating the top wing with the decal repaired section today then need to figure out where to go with the engines...
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Thank you all. That was a big help. I have built up the jig to some extent. The part I am talking about that has the slots too narrow is the section that holds up the wings. Both upper arms with slots are too narrow to be able to insert a screw. Since you mention that yours are ok guess I should file out the slots to fit. The pictures you posted petrov27 Helped much. I also bought a WNW AEG G.4 early and bought all Photo etch parts from HGW for it, as well as many details from Taurus. They haven't arrived yet but when they do I'll start the build.
Cheers,
Alec
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I don't know where I can find replacement screws. They are a special type. My emails to vertigo never seem to get any replies. I will check each screw with a micrometer to see if there are 2 smaller widths. If not I think I will just file the square section underneath the top of the screw instead of filing the slot wider. I will say one thing customer service with them is bad news. I asked several times about the jig before I even bought it but never got any replies, so I went ahead and bought it anyway. I think it was a stupid mistake. I never expected to rebuild the whole bloody thing. What a nightmare.
Cheers,
Alec
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I don't know where I can find replacement screws. They are a special type. My emails to vertigo never seem to get any replies. I will check each screw with a micrometer to see if there are 2 smaller widths. If not I think I will just file the square section underneath the top of the screw instead of filing the slot wider. I will say one thing customer service with them is bad news. I asked several times about the jig before I even bought it but never got any replies, so I went ahead and bought it anyway. I think it was a stupid mistake. I never expected to rebuild the whole bloody thing. What a nightmare.
Cheers,
Alec
Alec, to match the screw you need the diameter and the pitch. Easiest way to derive the thread pitch is with a pitch gauge. Metric and ANSI threads are different. I would assume based on where this jig is from it will have metric hardware. Both systems have coarse and fine pitch standards. A pitch gauge can be obtained at most hardware and auto parts stores. Often bike shops have them too.
Common metric screws come in very regular sizes e.g. M5 M6 M8 etc -- the screw will be very slightly less than the nominal diameter.
Once you figure out the size, if you are in the US, McMaster Carr (mcmaster.com) has just about every conceivable type of hardware including screws, and a very easy and intuitative site to find it on. They ship quickly -- I often get stuff from them next day, even when I'm at our cabin in the boonies. For really weird stuff you can try Fastenall as well.
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I think I understand the issue - the "square" section under the screw-head should be smaller width than the slots cut into the acrylic pieces - supposed to enable the screw to "slide" up or down the slot to adjust the height of each hold point/arm with just a slight loosen to the wingnut, but in this case the slots are not cut wide enough...
Come to think of it, mine are very tight fits as well and you can't really slide the pieces very easy. It didnt make much difference to me as I dont see having to adjust it all that much - just once per model anyway :)
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- the "square" section under the screw-head
Ah. Those are called elevator bolts.
https://www.mcmaster.com/#elevator-bolts/=168pdwm
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Thank you all,
I have disassembled this Jig 4 times already to no avail. You have a point Petrov27. But why should anyone put up with a bad product when good money was paid for it. I tried filing the screw/bolt but it would take a month of Sundays before a dent was made. Filing to open the slot is worthless. I sent an email to Vertigo, This is the 4th. time asking why they don't answer their mails and telling them what I think of their customer service. Apparently from what you say Petrov27 that particular slot being cut wrong is standard procedure with them and I won't tolerate it. They are either going to fix the bloody thing or will be cringing by the time I'm through with them. Replacing screws at my expense and having to buy in quantity is not an option and rebuilding a product that money was paid for doesn't make sense. Oh well my wrath will be upon them LOL ;D 8)
Cheers,
Alec
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It is possible that they aren't recieving your emails. This does happen! Or they may just have terrible customer service.
Meanwhile, if it were mine I'd find a way to fix it -- apparently it is just missing a rather common screw that you may be able to source at a good hardware store for 25 cents.
I can't tell from Petrov's pics if the screws are carriage bolts or elevator bolts. Difference is the way the head is sloped, and also the square section on a carriage bolt is wider than the threads. On an elevator bolt, the square shank is the same width as the thread.
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Oh -- looked again at Petrov's photo -- those appear to be ordinary carriage bolts. You should be able to find those at any decent hardware store for pennies a piece.
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I would say that it is a carriage bolt, Flat round head sloped from higher top to sides, square section wider than threads. I am just wondering if this was deliberately designed like this. Since it is strange that the jigs seem to be standard, At any rate after 5 Emails there is no answer and none have been returned.
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Thank you I have done some of that and it is beginning to move a bit. As an aside to Petrov and others that are using the Vertigo Jig. I would like your input on how it has helped your model work and some ways you have discovered on different uses you have found for it.
Thank you
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I still haven't calmed down. I think maybe it is because my wife of 64 years marriage recently died and me and the dog are having a major time coping. Anyway in some of my rage I broke a couple of pieces but with Acc they are back together and re-polished with sanding sticks and Novus. Working on the carriage bolts and having to file the threads to fi,t the bolts slipped into place but can't move. I cannot understand why the two uprights that hold the wings have the slots much narrower unless that is the way it has to be. At any rate I got it together at last after filing and sanding the bolts and the two slots and rebuilding it 5 times. I must admit it was really satisfying building something else for a change. It will be a long time until I return to peace, maybe never.
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Oh no! My condolences for your sad loss! I wish you all the best to get through these dark times.
Borsos
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Sincere condolences Alec.
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Deepest condolences Alec
H
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Oh, my. This is terrible, I won't even imagine...
hope you will manage to get over this and find peace in your mind again.
Bye,
Manni
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My thoughts and best wishes for the future are with you Alec. I know your pain, I was widowed 30 years ago after 22 years of marriage, and it's about as devastating as it can get. Trust me, you'll get through it with faith and concentrating on the good memories....
Take care and take it one positive step at a time,
Regards,
Lance
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So sorry to read that, best wishes to you.
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sorry man - condolences....
Regarding your question on how the Vertigo holder has worked for me; for the most part it is simply nice to have something that holds the model off the worktable and keeps it from sliding around etc. It also raises it a bit which helps with my issues with neck and back pain.
I have not had it long so I dont have a ton of experience yet with it. The first biplane to be done on it will likley be the AEG (though this box of WNW Camel is really screaming to me to start that too) - once I get to gluing that top wing on I am hoping the Vertigo will assist with alignment etc
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Thank you all for your caring. I hope I can get through it. but the ache is unbelievable. The worst part of all is that my oldest son had a stroke about a year ago and is still recuperating, My next daughter had a stroke 2 weeks ago and is still in the hospital and my 3rd daughter lost her husband to death and is also having problems. As for me I haven't seen a doctor in over 42 years and just reached 87 years old 4 days ago. How do you figure. I have to learn to keep away from model work when I don't feel right. :(
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That is utterly amazing that they emailed you. I sent them 5 emails and got no reply for any of them. Be aware that the jig is very nice and not too difficult to use. I also think that it was purposely designed with the wing hold section with a narrower slot to make it more secure to hold the wings. I have got the bolt to slide into the slot and hold tight. To remove it just needs to be hit with a light tap with a small hammer to release it when needed. It would be nice if they at least responded and explained the feature. I haven't used it yet but it sure will help align the wings.
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I have the old (I believe no longer being marketed) AeroClub Jig, and use it a lot.
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n583/lcarroll1/Brisfit/IMG_2119.jpg) (http://s1141.photobucket.com/user/lcarroll1/media/Brisfit/IMG_2119.jpg.html)
On the positive side I can set the "sweep" of the top to the bottom wing, the space between them, and clamp everything firmly in place. It's only shortcoming, easily prevented with padding, is the metal parts scrape the paint off the mating surfaces very easily. Besides my "Magic Third Hand" it's my favorite and most indispensable tool.
Cheers,
Lance
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I did not have great service from them and when I got my stand it was cracked, probably because it was in an envelope instead of a box. None the less I did like the stand. I found that UMM sold them and that's where I got another one.
https://umm-usa.com/onlinestore/index.php?manufacturers_id=114&osCsid=d4262cbf8d40c8e677865eb2164a8484
So maybe this would be a better alternative. HTHs
As for my second I couldn't get it glued together and it is sitting somewhere on the bench waiting for me to make time to build it.
James
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Never had any issues with UMM - that is where I got my Vertigo stand as well
They have quite a nice selection of useful model tools
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Steve,
I assembled mine last week and found all the same things you did regarding "square" edges, narrow slots, and even a popsicle stick sanding tool! I wasn't able to find any of the acrylic cement you recommended earlier (in this small and remote community anything beyond carpenter's white glue is difficult to find) however cheap 5 minute epoxy worked very well. The thing may have to be modified to work on a Gotha however it's easily large enough to handle two seaters in 1:32 Scale which my AeroClub version wouldn't hold, and is why I invested in this one.
Thanks for posting this, I wish it had come a week earlier if only to validate my own thoughts on it. This should help others deal with any issues on the product.
Cheers,
Lance
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Neat! Should work like a charm; be sure to publish a photo once you get back to the Gotha and mount her onto the modified Base.
Cheers,
Lance
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In no way could I recommend Vertigo.
I just got a jig from them that I orders and cancelled.
I believe Vertigo have the anal/cranial matrix syndrome firmly in place.
I must agree with Steve's comment.
Vertigo do not respond to order queries, are slow in sending out orders and, in my case, got the order wrong and left me out of pocket.
Don't use them.
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I do have the wooden jig from UMM:
(http://i644.photobucket.com/albums/uu169/krow113/brisfit/IMG_4014.jpg) (http://s644.photobucket.com/user/krow113/media/brisfit/IMG_4014.jpg.html)
And worked with jigs for many work situations.
The jig is part of the thinking now for me , I was able to do a ton of procedures without compromising the model.
I added fender washers to the base to get some stability , and made some purpose built parts as well.
This is the JM Models jig: http://www.jhmodels.eu/plastic-models/model-stands/no-3201-stand-new/
What I can't work out from their website is which one. Which jig is the one for 1/32 scale biplanes?
Richard