forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
Modelers Lounge => Time to relax => Topic started by: Jamo on February 06, 2015, 04:13:50 PM
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I have never built a car model before but I couldn't resist this beauty. Here is the box alongside a Wingnut Wings Sopwith Triplane for comparison
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Boxes.jpg)
Bought it on ebay from an Italian modelshop for 134 Euro plus postage of 36 Euro, which came to $264 NZD. The kit derives from an old Protar kit, but moulded in plastic not white metal.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Boxes_2.jpg)
Love the engine, a WWI Fiat A12 22 litre straight six aero engine modified to produce approximately 320 hp. Here is the crankcase alongside a 1/32 Benz engine:
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Engines.jpg)
The car was nicknamed Mefistofele due to the loud noise from the exhaust. No reverse gear, and apparently no brakes if you believe the internet(?) fuel consumption 1.4mpg, Brit Sir Ernest Eldridge drove it to a world land speed record of 234.98 kph at Arpajon in France on 12 July, 1924, a record it held for only 32 days. In 1969, the Mefistofele was purchased from Sir Eldridge's heirs by Fiat's boss Giovanni Agnelli. It was then shipped to Italy, where it was treated to a major restoration and added to the company's historic collection. It currently resides in the Centro Storico Fiat in Turin.
(http://blog.motosound.de/wp-content/uploads/Fiat_Mefistofele_1924_4.jpg)
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What a great find Jamo, it certainly looks to be a pretty good kit of a very impressive vehicle, just imagine the detailing you will be able to add, looking forward to seeing you start this one.
Des.
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This thing looks terrific, I was having the box in my hands few weeks ago, but it was not possible to open it and check the contents. Unfortunately the price of this thing stops me to get it :( Otherwise I love the cars from 1920s up to ~1960s. Which reminds me, that Tamiya will release this March a new mould 1/24 Mercedes 300 SL Gulwing
Best regards,
Sasho
PS: Please, please, please open a WiP thread, so we can live hte build together with you :)
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Very envious! I have been lusting after this model since it was released... I can see me doing something rash if I come across it when I am Europe in June.
Mefistofele was at the Goodwood Festival of Speed when I was there in 2013. Somewhere I think I have photos...I will see if I can find them
I am looking forward to seeing your progress on this
Cheers
Tony
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The real thing. Of course if I knew there was going to be a model of the thing I would have taken many more
(http://i435.photobucket.com/albums/qq78/kiwipugfan/IMG_8480_zpsca4ta7qr.jpg) (http://s435.photobucket.com/user/kiwipugfan/media/IMG_8480_zpsca4ta7qr.jpg.html)
(http://i435.photobucket.com/albums/qq78/kiwipugfan/IMG_8481_zpspzkqdgnv.jpg) (http://s435.photobucket.com/user/kiwipugfan/media/IMG_8481_zpspzkqdgnv.jpg.html)
(http://i435.photobucket.com/albums/qq78/kiwipugfan/IMG_8482_zpsrrvipfol.jpg) (http://s435.photobucket.com/user/kiwipugfan/media/IMG_8482_zpsrrvipfol.jpg.html)
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Awesome, Jamo. You just can't beat those Italian prewar cars for cool. I might have to add this kit to my wish list. I hope you do a build log, I'd love to follow along.
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Damn it Jamo, I was hoping that the Airfix Bentley I'm building was going to be the only car I did, but this is........tempting...and in the same scale too....
Ian
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This is indeed very cool....not a word I use a lot but it certainly fits here.
Just from an aesthetic point of view there are so many cars from that era that really appeal to me.....just like the Schneider Cup racers.
Yes indeed, please run a build log, Jamo. (Especially if it includes a wake of your incredible water.....not really sure how that would work but if anyone can pull it off, you are the magician to do it.)
Cheers from frigid NYC,
Michael
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PS....I think we should all do an intervention and make sure Bo does NOT get his hands on one of these kits. I mean...can you imagine?
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Thanks for the feedback guys. Here are a few more shots of the kit contents
A nice little plastic box with the tubing, screws, exhaust wrap and faux leather (which will probably get replaced)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030475.jpg)
Spark plug leads and carburettors
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030467.jpg)
Fuel lead connectors and priming cups
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030466.jpg)
Valve gear covers and rocker arms
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030471.jpg)
Clear parts for instrument faces, windscreen and the big Fiat mask for painting the radiator marking
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030474.jpg)
Decals (the strips are intended to be the hose clamps but I think I can improve on those)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030473.jpg)
Close up on the instrument dials
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030473b.jpg)
The data plate should have been in brass
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030473c.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Dataplate.jpg)
Tyres are vinyl
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030470.jpg)
Wooden floors have raised panel lines and grain which will need to be sanded back, but nice screw head detail to be kept
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030468.jpg)
I have started cleaning up and opening the louvres using a strip of sandpaper fitted into a thin PE saw blade.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030472.jpg)
I gave up sanding the engine covers to a more realistic thickness and switched to scraping using a scalpel. Lot of plastic to remove
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030463.jpg)
Thanks for looking in
Cheers
James
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This is what Airfix could have done.....very impressive detail parts. I almost always pare down thick parts with a blade, then sand smooth. It's much quicker, but the shaved pieces stick to everything!
Ian
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This is going to be a real treat watching you build this kit Jamo, thanks for doing the build log here.
Des.
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I saw the real deal at Goodwood festival.
Also saw this being released by Italeri and salivated for some time before sanity grbbed me by the **lls and said keep the dosh for your WNW addiction.
I'll follow what you do with great interest though, but it would have been nice if Italeri had updated the kit a little with some PE chain drives etc.
I'm sure yo'll build a real gem from it none the less.
Maybe that dataplate started out painted but got lovingly polished by someone?
Keith
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It's a great kit I hope there is some aftermarket for it I'd love a real brass radiater and some metal springs like the ones in the Protar Fiat 806 Its an awesome car If you look it up on You Tube there is a video of it being started and ran I think it would be a real beast to drive
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Great, you started it :) I will thoroughly enjoy this build log!
Removing the raised wood grain without loosing the bolt heads will be tedious job. I was also wondering if there are aftermarket parts for this beaty
Looking to the next update
Best regards,
Sasho
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After market parts I have found so far:
1/12 scale spark plugs from RB Motion
(http://www.rbmotion.com/image/cache/data/web%201218-228x228.JPG)
http://www.rbmotion.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=55
RB Motion also do a nice range of nuts machined from aluminium in various sizes
(http://www.rbmotion.com/pete1/rbm_shop/image/data/nutstudpins_full.jpg)
http://www.rbmotion.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=77_106
(http://www.rbmotion.com/image/cache/data/nuts-80x80.jpg)
http://www.rbmotion.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=76_97
I found lots of 1/12 scale motor cycle accessories over at Hiroboy
They have photo etched motorcycle chains from Top Studio Detail Master (but are quite expensive £33.95 :o and I would need two sets). They come with a PE jig for assembly and look brilliant.
http://www.hiroboy.com/catalog/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=chain&x=0&y=0
(https://www.hiroboy.com/catalog/images/TD23013b.jpg)
(http://www.hiroboy.com/catalog/product_images/typical-chainset.jpg)
I have found some photo etched hexagonal mesh sets, some from Hasegawa and Crazy Modeler but I am unsure about the hex size, which would need to be fairly large
(http://d2ev13g7cze5ka.cloudfront.net/hsg/hsgpa-43_0.jpg?v=0000000001)
Hose clips from Hobby Design
(http://www.hiroboy.com/catalog/images2/hobbydesign/hd02-0047a.jpg)
(http://www.hiroboy.com/catalog/images2/hobbydesign/hd02-0047c.jpg)
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A great lot of accessories for you magnificent model James. Be prepared for a very long and fiddly job assembling the Top Studio roller chain, if you remember I did one for my scratch Huck starter, but they are a brilliant product.
Des.
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I had found some of those while looking for bits for the Bentley, but the hose clips look great! Top Studio also do hose connectors for oil lines et. Re the mesh, take a look at my Bentley build and let me know if the mesh I have used on the radiator is suitable. It's 0.94mm aperture and 0.22mm wire thickness. If it's suitable I'd be more than happy to send you enough to do your rad and anything else you may need - they sent me 2 sheets and I only ordered one so I have plenty to spare!
Ian
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The engine crankcase lacks the supporting brackets for attaching to the engine bearers (actually it lacks the engine bearers as well). I have made the eight supports and the 24 arches from plastic card. Also had to sand off the oil breather tubes as they were the wrong shape and in the wrong place. Haven't added those yet.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030503sm.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030504sm.jpg)
The cylinder heads didn't fit particularly well so lots of scrapping and sanding. Its certainly not a WNW kit as far as sinkmarks and seams go. But the engine looks fantastic! So much detailing possible in this large scale.
The camshaft is not glued yet, I also have to replace all the thin valve springs with something more meaty. Parts are only dry fitted to give an impression of overall shape
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030506sm.jpg)
Sparkplugs and bolt heads have arrived from RB Motion, more photos soon
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Looking great! I think I will be in trouble if I find one in a model shop when I take my group to Le Mans in June...
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That is one beautiful (and big) looking engine James, looking forward to you adding all your details, this should be a showpiece by the time you are finished.
Des.
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Nice work so far, Jamo. I'm following this one closely...
Ian
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I have never built a model car, but this one appeals to me. However looking at prices it is around $200 Canadian. Not sure what you paid, but if a similar amount, do you think you have gotten good value for the money ? Taking into account how much extra work and aftermarket pieces you need to make an accurate model of the real version
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Value for money is a tricky concept. Depends on your budget and how much you like a particular model compared to the next best alternative. If I take a year to build the kit with all the corrections and after market bits then it will work out as a cheap past-time compared to say playing golf, drinking lots of beer or going to restaurants on a regular basis. I paid NZ$264 including postage, no customs or tax payable. It is certainly a lot cheaper than buying the original Protar kit on ebay, which cost an arm and a leg.
By the way will post some updates after I get home this evening
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Nice work Jamo! Looking forward to seeing the latest.
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I have collected a large number of images after searching the net and the more I look at them, the more I notice areas of the kit that are overly simplified.
They are not especially visible but the inward ends of the magnetos are just wrong:
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1040454.jpg)
Here are some images of the real thing:
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Magnetos_7.jpg)
Still work in progress, I still need to make some toothed wheels to put inside the inner end of the magnetos and other stuff
It is also clear that the crankcase is too long, the water pump is missing and the frame that holds up the magnetos is also missing
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1040455.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1040456.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Drawing.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Fiat_A12bis.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Water%20pump.jpg)
Note that Mefistofele's Fiant A.12 engine was modified with two extra spark plugs per cylinder which necessitated two additional magnetos, making a total of four.
Also missing from the crankcase are a set of bolts between the cylinders
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Bolts.jpg)
I have added the seats for these bolts (white sections in the photo above) but not the bolts themselves yet.
I have also reshaped the cylinder heads to reduce the size of the inlet and outlet manifolds
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030512_sm.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1030515_sm.jpg)
This photo was very useful
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Cylinder%20head.jpg)
The instructions show the rear suspension springs upside down which is incorrect and will raise the rear of the car by a centimeter
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Rear%20Springs%20Instructions.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Back_1.jpg)
Thanks for looking in
James
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Fantastic update James, you are very fortunate to have really good reference photos to go by, but like Justin said, this leads to many many hours/days of extra detailing work, it will be all worth it in the end. The engine is a massive kit, adding every tiny bit of detail will prove very rewarding, looking forward to your next steps in the build progress.
Des.
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Great investigation, and great work so far. Like to see this to the end.
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Great stuff Jamo. Did you buy a second engine sprue?
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Hi Bo: No I borrowed an unstarted kit from a friend at our local IPMS club to help with some comparison photos.
Some more corrections:
The rear chassis frame is overly simplified where the suspension dampers are attached. It needs to be cut away (not quite finished yet, still a bit rough):
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Chassis.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Chassis_b.jpg)
Here are the photos that show the issue
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Rear%20Damper%20fittings.jpg)
Some filling in of the front chassis inner side is needed
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Front%20chassis.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Front%2031b.jpg)
Before & after comparison photo of some of the work needed to remove and fill the various screw holes
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Front%20axle.jpg)
The bar axle is meant to taper in width in the middle, which means substantial add ons at the bottom corners
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/P1040450.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Front%20suspension.jpg)
The suspension spring leaves need to be wrapped to represent the greased cord bindings. After investigating various threads (which were too furry) and monofilament fishing line (hard to keep in place while wrapping) I used some brass beading wire.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Springs.jpg)
Thanks for looking in
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af234/Jamo_kiwi/Italeri%20Fiat%20Mefistofele%20kit/Mefisto%20logo.jpg)
Cheers
James
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You are making excellent progress James, the modifications you are doing though time consuming will make this a superb and accurate model.
Des.
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very nice jamo, i like it alot. looks like great fun.
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great update :) It is shaping perfectly so far!
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Hi James.
I tried to PM you, but not sure whether you got my message! Did you ever finish this build? I'd love to see it, as I'm working on the same kit.
Cheers,
Johnny