forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
The WW1 modelers' reference library => Aircraft => Topic started by: Jamo on September 21, 2013, 09:02:58 AM
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Koloman Mayrhofer and his team made five reproduction Fokker E.V/D.VIII wings on commission for Langdon Badger, Achim Engels in Germany and The Vintage Aviator Ltd in New Zealand. His website is here:
http://www.craftlab.at/index.php?id=3&L=1&cHash=c0261f27b412d59499699d2463a6241f
"The project consisted of building a series of five wings for this 1918 aircraft type. Our reproduction is mainly based on research by Mr Langdon Badger, who also took the first set of wings for his project.
Constructed as a cantilever wing with plywood covering, this layout later became the trademark of the Fokker company.
The project faithfully reproduced not only the external dimensions, but also all other construction details. Some aileron modifications were required to meet current certification requirements."
A series of photographs are presented showing the wings being built which offer valuable insights for modellers endeavouring to replicate the streaky Fokker finish that is now generally regarded as more accurate than the Fokker olive green.
Here are links to the images. Make sure you click on the images to see them full size.
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/a699d007ef.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/3a55240f1f.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/07adc71821.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/1e4969c448.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/54f6add2c5.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/0298862f38.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/6c9ca26bed.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/5226a81be6.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/f63d4c8473.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/d07969a585.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/47a0d625d3.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/e7cc52468f.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/ce85ae2718.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/8d31fd7e3b.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/25c8a8999f.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/67667907ed.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/db7d1a1192.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/7e7d76d00a.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/f29c811894.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/f211719c83.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/e0c784ea27.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/44a538b582.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/42c39d3230.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/e4941910cc.jpg)
(http://www.craftlab.at/typo3temp/pics/d678d34a65.jpg)
Cheers
James
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Thanks very much James for these fantastic photos and the link, all brilliant reference material.
Des.
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Thanks for posting, James. Those photos are a great reference resource.
Cheers,
Ernie :)
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Indeed, thanks James. They are really helpful.
In a different thread Zabu was kind enough to include a photo of the 'snake and rabbit' EV I have just started and also some notes on it quoted from Dan San Abot. I hope Zabu doesn't mind me re-posting the notes here because they raise two questions. First, here's the quote:
The Fok.E.V is in the top elevation with the nose pointing up. The slope of the streaking is \. From leading edge to trailing the slope spans two rib bays at the center portion of the wing. Number the wing ribs left to right from 1 to 26.
Wing tip to 1.75 is green, to rib 4.25 is brown, to 6.5 is green, to 9.0 is brown, to 11 green, to 14 is brown, to 16.5 is green, to 19.5 is brown, to 22.75 is green, to the wing tip is brown. On the under surface of the wing the Azin violet* (17A7), matches the mocha brown* (5F7), and the azure blue* (23A7), matches the True green*(27A7), on the leading and trailing edges. The wing is streaked with these stains,(not paint) much like the Fok.DR.I. The base color would be the birch plywood, pale yellow. After the stained dried, the wing was varnished to waterproof the wing surfaces. The Methuen codes listed are the specific colors listed on the Fokker E.V wing drawing by definition.
By my reckoning that means ten stripes of colour on the 'snake and rabbit' EV . Has anyone else come across that many?
Dan San Abot also says that in the top elevation with the nose pointing up The slope of the streaking is \. In the examples and drawings of other EVs I've seen the slopes go /. Did the Fokker vary things in this way when applying the streaking.
Best wishes
Nigel
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I would want to see the photo if possible - this Fok E.V I have not seen anywhere. Has it been published?
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Hi James
The photo Zabu was kind enough to provide is in reply 26 in the Completed Models thread I do build models honestly! It shows the snake and rabbit EV in a hanger/store of sorts and was taken from ground level looking towards the aircraft from a position in front of the starboard side. I don't think it's clear enough to to see the streaking, but the Dan San Abot quote is as posted beneath the photo.
Best wishes
Nigel
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Great pic. Thanks for posting.
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Hi guys.
About the pic I don't know if she has been published in any book... but I couldn't find it anywhere among my books... so i guess that it's quite difficult to have.
I took it from a thread some time ago and if i can remember it was said to be taken in a depot, an Armee Flugpark (it's my german right?), probably after the Fokkers V were grounded(?). Would it be any good if a could try to find that thread link for you guys?
Sorry guys if i can't more helpfull... i'm no expert on the subjet, i'm just a curious guy that has some fun researching for this things.
Cheers
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Hi Zabu
I found the photo in your Photobucket album. Surprising that Dan San Abbott was so definitive about the number of the colour changes in the streaking as it does not appear at all obvious to me. He did have a habit of stating some things as facts that were actually only his opinions, and not all of these were correct.
Some of the images posted in threads dealing with Fokker E.V over at The Aerodrome have had their links broken and are no longer available so it is a good idea to save them when you can. Same for those above on this thread
Cheers
James
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Yes your right Jamo, it's not at all obvious to me either.
A little update about the picture, I found one big thread related to this subject and snake and rabbit Fokker V picture (originally posted by StephenLawson). After all it's seems that when photo was taken the aircraft was in french hands.
I'll leave the thread link for you guys to take a look... it's a big one.
http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/camouflage-markings/20727-fokker-d8-wing-streaking-test-update.html
Cheers
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Jamo,
thank you for posting those absolutely impressive photos.
Stefan
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Zabu Thank you for the link - The thread there runs to over 40 pages!
Little did I know when I embarked on this adventure.
Best wishes
Nigel
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Its the right colours................................................................................but I hate them....................
Steve
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yes - fantastic pictures and what great craftsmanship going into those wings!
The colors really strike me as looking odd though as I am so conditioned to the look of the EV with solid "fokker green" paint....
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Wow, there is something incredible about actually seeing the insides of a full-size wooden wing! You always know that they were built of wood but seeing one 'naked'...you just kind of sit back and are amazed. At least I am.
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Hi James,
I've only recently joined the forum, and while looking for info on the Fokker E.V found your topic. Apologies for resurrecting it after (only!) eight years :D
The links to the photographs seem to have disappeared. Is there any chance that they could be reinstated as I'm fascinated by this new (to me!) information on the E.V/D.VIII wing. I was presuming that the Windsock Datafile was still the go-to source, but I understand that its information is now outdated in a number of respects.
Thanks for any help!
Kind regards,
Mark
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Looks like we are lucky here, and he just reorganized his site. (Sometimes photos are hosted on a third part site that is terminated, and it's gone)
Looks like the photos are now at https://www.craftlab.at/fokker-d-8 (https://www.craftlab.at/fokker-d-8)
Rick
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Hi Rick,
Many thanks for that - those photos are phenomenal!
Such amazing work to recreate a wooden structure of such complexity with modern machinery, so all the more incredible that they were production-line produced 100 years ago.
Thanks again and kind regards,
Mark
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The selection on colors do not makes sense in my eyes.
Brown/green was not allowed due to likelihood of confusion with french aircraft and why mauve below the wing?
My interpretation and the discussion about the reasons here:
https://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=8550.0
Cheers,
Frank
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Hi Frank,
many thanks for your reply and especially for the link to your superb build. Your choice of colours and reasoning behind that choice makes absolute sense to me.
Let me say first and foremost that I am no researcher: I am a model builder and a historian only thanks to the efforts of those who are researchers.
But it seemed (to me) unlikely that the upper wing surface would contain a brown tone for the very reason of mis-identification of the E.V, which was of course a new type in service and therefore unfamiliar, as an Allied aeroplane. That and the fact that previously German aeroplanes had been coloured green and mauve on their upper surfaces.
I believe I'm correct in saying that where painted, the under-surfaces of German aeroplanes were finished a single tone pale blue.
So it also seemed (to me) that given the stringencies of the late war period that a two-tone undersurface scheme would be unlikely. Also, the mauve on the undersurfaces appears to be a very bright shade whereas I would have thought that it would have been more of a tonal match to the undersurface lozenge on the bottom of the fuselage.
But as I say, I am merely a model builder and no researcher, and bow to the knowledge of those who are!
Thanks again and kind regards,
Mark