forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Under Construction => Scratch builds => Topic started by: lone modeller on October 09, 2022, 06:08:39 AM
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Evening All,
I am going off at a bit of a tangent at the moment because I am taking part in a GB on another site - prototypes, etc. I have been a bit stuck with the BE for a number of reasons and need something to get my motivation moving. In addition I am having problems sanding and filing because I have a shoulder problem which is being diagnosed, (probably arthritis). I have managed to mould the halves for the upper wing of the BE at last but they will need quite a lot of filing and filling, followed by sanding and I can only cope with short periods of that. Progress is inevitably slow and a bit demoralising as after several sessions there is little to show for the effort. I decided that I needed a small side project which would not take so long and get some faster results. I am continuing with the BE and hope to post something in the not-too-distant future.
In the meantime I have started an Albatros CII: a pusher (of course) of which only one prototype was built. There are no drawings that I can find but there are 5 photos of the type at https://flyingmachines.ru/Site2/Crafts/Craft25754.htm
Basically the wings were taken from a CI and the forward fuselage was reversed and shortened so that the engine was at the rear and the pilot's cockpit was in the nose. In the CII the pilot was placed in the rear cockpit and observer in front. The undercarriage was from a CI but the booms and tail unit were new. I have the dimensions of the CII and I have drawn my own plans from existing CI plans and the published CII dimensions: it is the best anyone can do.
I have cut wing blanks from 30 thou card which has been bent in a pipe and added the ribs from 10 x 20 thou Evergreen strip. In the image below the three stages of wing construction are shown:
top - complete with ribs sanded and trailing edge scalloped;
bottom right - ribs attached and trimmed but not sanded;
bottom left - ribs added but not trimmed.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52413897608_f89ef9cf1b_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nRCVFN)
Thanks for looking.
Stephen.
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This is fantastic Stephen. I never knew of this machine. Great idea for a scratch built project.
Very sorry to hear about your shoulder. I’m hoping you can find some good relief for the pain and are able to continue doing the things you enjoy.
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Oh I like this - popcorn and comfy cushion to watch this one come along on standby ;D
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Me to! :)
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Great subject! There weren't many German pushers and the Albatros C.II is one of my favourites. I will watch with great interest.
May I suggest another one Stephen :) A German V-strutter sesquiplane pusher prototype, the Zeppelin-Lindau (Dornier) V.I.
It was actually produced in resin by Classic Plane in 1/72 but is no longer available.
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Many thanks for the encouraging words gentlemen - much appreciated.
Enathan: I have already scratch built an Otto Doppeldekker and Ago CII and was aware of the Dornier V1 - the latter is on my "to scratch build" list! According to M. Schmeelke Zeppelin-Lindau Aircraft of WW1 the test pilot managed to tip the machine onto its nose during taxiing trials and then failed to appear for the first test flight. The substitute pilot, von Haller was killed after takeoff when the machine abruptly stalled and crashed. Not a successful design...
Stephen.
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Yep, a perfect subject for modelling Stephen ;)
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I'm looking forward to seeing your progress on this one, Stephen.
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REAL modelling!
Great progress so far, Stephen. I only knew this machine from one sole picture in the Putnam German WWI book so I'll be interested to see what the 'trellis tail' looks like on completion.
Sandy
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I've never heard of this type before, it certainly has a few areas that resemble a Vickers Gunbus. Should be interesting to watch this come together.
I hope the shoulder eases up.
BTW are you going to Telford this year?
Ian
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Lovely start Stephen! Another neat machine to watch.
As sorry as I am to hear of your troubles on the BE I'm more concerned to hear about your shoulder issues. I hope they're diagnosed soon and a suitable treatment found.
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Hi Stephen, apologies for the extended absence. You've certainly made a cracking start on this one despite the shoulder problems. I hope you are recovering and able to resume the sanding and filing without any pain.
Best wishes
Richie
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Evening All,
Thank you Ken, Sandy, Ian, Zac and Richie for dropping by and leaving such kind comments. They are much appreciated.
The wings are now pretty much finished - the ribs have been rubbed down and primed to make sure that all is ready for painting later. I have not taken pictures as there is little to show.
I have carved a male mould for the fuselage nacelle from balsa. I used plywood for the female mould (basically a hole cut to the shape of the side profile), and made the nacelle halves from 30 thou Evergreen sheet styrene:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52457164722_69210fa215_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nVsFuw)
As the shape is simple it did not hurt my shoulder too much! In the above image I have cut one half of the fuselage from the sheet - the other has still to be cut out. You can see that it is very much like a vacuform and requires similar techniques to cut out. After sanding the edges of the halves I was able to achieve an acceptable pair of nacelle halves:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52457164577_502dd4c1e5_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nVsFs2)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52458218093_5668d74bb1_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nVy5C6)
The second image shows that the joint underneath is good enough and will only need a small amount of filling and filing. The cockpit interior was basic as I have no details of what it was like - it is loosely based on an Albatros CI from which the nacelle was probably derived. Everything was made from card. The interior of the cockpits was painted in brown as the nacelle was made from wood, the rear was black because the engine will occupy that space and nothing much will be seen. The cockpit openings were cut with a knife and finished with a round file. The small pieces of plastic on the bottom are to help join the nacelle halves and fill the minor gap in that area:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52457164672_725685c0f7_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nVsFtE)
I have also scratch built the cylinders for the engine and added a valve cover on the top, and cut an exhaust mainfold from card:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52457955724_6f4a9152d4_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nVwJCu)
The next steps will be to assemble the nacelle and clean it up, instal the engine and fit the lower wings to the nacelle.
Thanks for looking.
Stephen.
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As the shape is simple it did not hurt my shoulder too much!
As excited as I am to see this build progressing (very!) I'm glad to hear it's not a painful experience for you, Stephen.
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Lovely job moulding the nacelle Stephen. That exhaust manifold looks perfect too. Very heartening to see you back at the bench, even more so to hear your shoulder isn't giving you so much grief.
Richie
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I'm a bit late in joining the party, but I'm already hooked Stephen....
I re_read some of your earlier build logs, trying to find how you mould your nacelles, but I couldn't find it. Vac_form? Boiling water? Heatgun?
Willem
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Willem,
I have probably not given a full description on this site of how I mould my plastic parts, but the method is variously described as push, plunge or plug moulding. Rather than try to describe in detail here how it is done I am attaching a link to another site where the method is fully described and illustrated.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/airfixtributeforum/making-push-or-plunge-moulds-t37829.html
I hope that this is helpful.
Stephen.
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Cracking start, Steve -
Great work on moulding the fuselage
Regards
Dave
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Thanks for the link Stephen, I scanned it briefly and it looks interesting. This weekend I'll have more time to read it thoroughly.
Willem
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Evening All
Thanks Dave for dropping by - you comment is much appreciated.
One of the minor problems which resulted from moulding the fuselage was the rounded corners on the lower sides. These corners should be square. To remedy this deficiency is simple: I glued some stretched sprue around the edges which need to be squared off. When this was dry I applied a liberal coat of plastic putty over the sprue, waited for that to set and then sanded the corners until they were square:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52489300354_7fe9207142_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYioi9)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52489570138_bcaa37ec04_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYjLuA)
I learned this from another modeller who makes vacuforms where the same problem frequently arises.
The lower wings were cemented to the nacelle one at a time. The first was attached, supported with a sophisticated jig, and allowed to set overnight:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52488908828_c09bd35402_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYgnUG)
Next day I repeated the process with the other lower wing.
With the wings in place and any small imperfections filled I was ready to fix the booms to the lower and upper wings. I have made many pushers and developed a simple technique which requires the same level of sophistication of jig manufacture as that required to fix the lower wings in place. First I use the side elevation to draw a line under the wing which touches the leading and trailing edges and continues to the rear beyond the leading edge of the horizontal stabilizer. Now measure the vertical distance on the plan from the new line to the leading edge of the rear horizontal stabilizer (distance a).
I use florists wire for the booms on my True Scale models and attach it to the wings by using the end of a round file to make a groove in the top or bottom surface of the rear of the wing. To locate where to file the groove, I place the nacelle and lower wing, or top wing, over the plans and trace the line of the booms on to the rear surfaces of the relevant wings. I measure how far forward the booms fit on to the wing - that marks the forward and deepest point of the groove. The florists wire is placed on the plans and four suitable lengths cut, two for each wing. (I know that this method is not 100% accurate but it is close enough in this scale that it does not matter if a boom is a couple of mm too long or short). The front ends of the booms are filed to make them flatter and thinner to achieve a larger surface in contact with the wing and allow the boom to taper forwards. The rear ends of the booms are filed to make a neat V when viewed from above and make a better mating surface.
Now make the jig. First lay the nacelle and wings over a copy of the plans so that the wings align with the plans exactly and lie flat on the bench. Take some scrap plastic/wood/card and make a support which is the same thickness as the vertical height (a) and place it so that the leading edge sits directly over the leading edge of the horizontal stabilizer on the plan. I use two part epoxy to attach the booms to the wings as this gives me a bit of wriggle time. When I am happy that the booms are properly set and aligned on the wing and are resting on the rear support I apply a small drop of CA to the V joint at the rear. This helps to stabilize the structure while the epoxy cures overnight.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52487865132_2685d8368d_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYb2DW)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52488360411_549340589a_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYdyTe)
Repeat the above operation with the top wing.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52488828305_05aa9b633a_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYfXYn)
The booms should now be at the correct angle in relation to the wings. The upper and lower parts of the aeroplane are now ready for painting.
I have made the wheels using another simple process. Cut the wheel discs from circles of 60 thou card: I cut out squares, trim the corners and finish with a file. I also file down the edges until they are about half the thickness of the card. Take a length of 60 thou rod, wind it around a paintbrush handle which is a slightly smaller diameter that the wheel discs, and immerse for a few seconds in boiling water. Remove from the water and plunge into cold water to set the plastic and leave a spiral. Cut off a length from the spiral which is slightly too long to fit over the disc, pull the ends of the cut plastic together to make them meet properly and place over the disc. By careful trimming of the end of the plastic rod a tyre can be cut which will sit tightly on the wheel disc. Hold in place with liquid cement and when dry clean up with filler and glass paper as necessary:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52488908388_68a21b677d_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nYgnM7)
I know that in the above image I have a tyre from red rod and a spiral from white: I used the last of an old spiral to make the first tyre.
Thanks for looking.
Stephen.
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Fascinating Stephen. I have limited experience with scratch building pushers (made a D.H.2 years ago, there was no kit around here and I had to scratch build one). Your methods are very interesting. I'll keep following.
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Very nice work and explanation of it. Makes one want to try scratch building at some point... is there a book or something that could help beginners!?
/Fredrik
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Nice update. The edge-sharpening trick will come in handy some time and has been mentally filed :)
Very nice work and explanation of it. Makes one want to try scratch building at some point... is there a book or something that could help beginners!?
/Fredrik
I was recommended Woodman’s book, which didn’t disappoint.
Fair use pdf:
https://rclibrary.co.uk/download_title.asp?ID=1216
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Very nice work and explanation of it. Makes one want to try scratch building at some point... is there a book or something that could help beginners!?
/Fredrik
Torbiorn has referenced the standard source that modellers go to, but I have found that looking at the build logs of other modellers who add extra details, convert models or scratch build are just as informative. The important thing to remember is that there is no right way to scratch build - a modeller has to work out for themselves which methods and techniques best suit them.
In any event give it a try - but be warned, once hooked there is no going back!!
Stephen.
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Another great update Stephen with a very clear explanation of your processes. I'm becoming very interested in these aircraft with engine at the wrong end as a result of your work.
Very nice work and explanation of it. Makes one want to try scratch building at some point... is there a book or something that could help beginners!?
/Fredrik
Yes Harry Woodman's book is a great starting point. There is a recent book I purchased Scratchbuilding Aircraft by Megas Tsonos which is brilliant and covers aircraft from many eras. As Stephen says reading through other people's build logs is a great way to learn. Do have a look at Kensar's Avro 504 build for a great way to make wings.
Richie
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Agree with Richie, Steve -
Fantastic progress and the solution to squaring off the fuselage is really simple and clever
Regards
Dave
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Willem,
I have probably not given a full description on this site of how I mould my plastic parts, but the method is variously described as push, plunge or plug moulding. Rather than try to describe in detail here how it is done I am attaching a link to another site where the method is fully described and illustrated.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/airfixtributeforum/making-push-or-plunge-moulds-t37829.html
I hope that this is helpful.
Stephen.
Thanks again for this link Stephen. I read the article thoroughly. It is very informative and interesting, and now I am contemplating on which parts of my build I can put it to use. And about what heat source to use.
The use of stretched sprue to square the edges is very clever. I've never used that technique, but there's a first time for everything.
I think the nacelle looks beautiful, and you have made wonderful progress. I can really see how this lovely and rare aircraft is getting its shape.
Thanks for your detailed explanation of your build. There is something to learn here for everyone, not just the scratch builders.
By the way, I love the sophisticated jigs... ;)
Cheers
Willem
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Evening All,
Thanks to you all for commenting on the build - your comments are always appreciated.
Willem: I am pleased if the explanations of my methods are helpful. Like many other modellers I read carefully the blogs posted here and elsewhere in search of ideas too: after all there are many ways to scratch build or add details to a kit and I have learned much from others.
I added the radiator between the pilot's cockpit and engine compartment and painted the model light blue - I am not certain that this is the correct colour but as I only have black and white images to work from I am happy with my interpretation. The machine seems to have been of a uniform colour except for the white squares for the background to the wing and rudder crosses:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508811225_31340ab544_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o12oct)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508880023_2867911ba4_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o12JDD)
The next step was to fit the upper wing. The procedure is simple enough: I cemented the four outer wing struts to the lower wing and CA'd the bottom of the rudder post to the end of the V of the booms attached to the lower wing. While the cement and CA had a little wriggle room I put cement into the strut holes of the upper wing and a drop of CA on to the upper part of the rudder post, and gently lowered the top wing and boom assembly so that the struts and rudder post could be put into place. To add additional support I inserted the rear inner wing struts and jigged the structure with paint pots and left it to harden overnight. I forgot to take the photos with the paint pots for these pictures, but they will appear later:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508332431_d932cb92c4_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nZYVSp)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508604864_123000eb04_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o11jRw)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508879578_22af62218d_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o12JvY)[
The remaining wing struts were fitted when the structure had been left overnight: here the complex jig arrangement has been set up to illustrate exactly how it works:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52508879283_18a950af63_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o12JqT)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52507852772_6dff5e49db_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nZWthq)
To finish the struts I added the cabanes first, and then the boom struts. All of the wing and cabane struts were cut from 20 x 30 thou Evergreen strip and sanded to aerofoil section. The boom struts were slightly larger so they were cut form 20 x 40 thou strip:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52507852472_0cafda273b_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nZWtcf)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52507852377_6f4e85964b_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2nZWtaB)
Thanks for looking.
Stephen.
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A fantastic demonstration of why complex, costly jigs and tools are not really needed to make a beautiful scratch built model. Although Humbrol enamels are not cheap these days!
Your wing making technique is superb, the styrene strips for ribs may take a lot of filing and sanding but they look superb. You've got me thinking about God's own scale now!
Richie
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Great work and what a nice colour!
Torbiorn has referenced the standard source that modellers go to, but I have found that looking at the build logs of other modellers who add extra details, convert models or scratch build are just as informative. The important thing to remember is that there is no right way to scratch build - a modeller has to work out for themselves which methods and techniques best suit them.
In any event give it a try - but be warned, once hooked there is no going back!!
Stephen.
I just realised I'd missed replies to my query on how to start scratch building. Sorry! But thanks for the tip on reading Torbiorn, Stephen and Richie. I'll keep following your builds and enjoy them as a start, and who knows when I give it a try?!
/Fredrik
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Excellent project… and a nicely rare subject. I personally love modelling pusher aircraft too. A bit challenging sometimes, but much rewarding. I have made a few Voisins and Farmans and a FE2b too…. Lately i have been thinking about starting an italian SP2. Very cool to see your Albatross coming to life
Skyhook
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She's coming along very nicely Stephen. I'm surprised at how short it is though - it must have been very unstable in pitch (fore and aft)!
Ian
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Wow, you are really up to speed Stephen.
It is really taking shape know!
Willem
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Evening All,
Many thanks Richie, Fredrik, Skyhook, Ian and Willem for your very kind comments.
I have completed the last parts of this build and the model is now complete. The first step was to make the main undercarriage which was fashioned from 30 thou card which was cut to V shape: well not quite a V as it has a short horizontal section between the legs. An axle was cut from 30 thou rod:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52549571486_2311fd6a47_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4ChNA)
A strip of 20 x 30 thou strip was filed to aerofoil section and attached to the forward parts of the legs to form a spreader bar. The tail skid was constructed from 20 thou rod and was a rather complex affair but was straightforward to construct:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52549865294_90d61e6d75_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4DN9f)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52550043815_db50095bd3_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4EHdc)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52549865149_2e0d5d741d_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4DN6K)
A propellor was carved from some hardwood strip and a boss made from a disc of 20 thou card:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52549113017_16803c83b9_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4zWvX)
With the final painting completed, wheels fitted to the axle and propellor in place the model is finished. I have not put on the serial number or the coloured stripe on the nose as seen in some photographs: I have gone for the simpler finish:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52549864969_37f7a76e54_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2o4DN3D)
I will post more photographs in the completed models section shortly.
Thanks for looking
Stephen.
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What a beautifully delicate scratch build, the lovely pale blue colour you chose really adds to the overall delicacy of the aircraft. It's an absolute gem, you should be very proud of your work.
Richie
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I agree with Richie - it looks delicate and delightful. Congratulations on a lovely build of something I never knew existed!
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Beautiful workmanship on a prototype I've not seen before.
Paul
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Great work and, as said before, very inspiring! Although I'm sure it's a lot harder than what you make it look like.
/Fredrik
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I went through the build log as I said I would. Your usual fantastic build!
RAGIII
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Another gem in your jewelry box Stephen, because that is what all your builds are:
GEMS!
Cheers,
Willem
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Another cracker for your collection. Lovely work as usual, and Happy New Year to you and yours Stephen.
Ian