forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => What's New => Topic started by: Manni on September 16, 2019, 03:15:24 PM
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Hello my friends. Seems like there is a tsunami coming....
Wingnut wings announced two new boxings.
The first is the Fokker DVII F of Hermann Göring http://www.wingnutwings.com/ww/product?productid=3208 (http://www.wingnutwings.com/ww/product?productid=3208)
and the second is a Sopwith 7F1 Snipe of William Barker http://www.wingnutwings.com/ww/product?productid=3209 (http://www.wingnutwings.com/ww/product?productid=3209)
Bye,
Manni
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I love the Barker figure and the Snipe.
Excellent addition to the family.
vB
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Nice to see new additions to WNW line.
But I somehow cannot leave this announcement without a comment that choosing H.G. as a face for D.VIIF seems a little bit out-of-place for me. :(
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Nice to see new additions to WNW line.
But I somehow cannot leave this announcement without a comment that choosing H.G. as a face for D.VIIF seems a little bit out-of-place for me. :(
Have to agree. While I'm not for rewriting or deleting history, I wish we weren't renewing attention for this man.
As a boy I bought the Revell 1:72 kit, which provided Goering's scheme. Made sense, since at that time no one really offered lozenge decals. When I built it I gave it a blue and red finish; maybe I'd picked up some distaste for the subject by then.
But it occurs to me that in 1:32 Goering's plane is a challenge, because the all white finish is liable to look rather toy like without some hints and shades and stains.
Interesting that Goering's grab handle was there all along in the original kit.
Mark
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Another point of view...
I don’t have a problem with the subject matter as we are building historical subject matter for World War One not World War Two.
Whilst I won’t be adding these kits to my stash I observe plenty of modellers seem to be happy enough to build Friedrich Christiansen’s HB W-29 without much comment on his later career.
At the end of the day they are plastic models, and the customer is free to choose what he or she is comfortable with.
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Another point of view...
I don’t have a problem with the subject matter as we are building historical subject matter for World War One not World War Two.
Whilst I won’t be adding these kits to my stash I observe plenty of modellers seem to be happy enough to build Friedrich Christiansen’s HB W-29 without much comment on his later career.
At the end of the day they are plastic models, and the customer is free to choose what he or she is comfortable with.
Agreed.
The context is purely WW1. Before Mr G turned into a complete Bell-End!
I won't be buying his ride... but Mr Barker? Well, there is a man I can do business with. ;)
vB
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Well said all of you, I commend your restraint. However, as your Moderator, I would be remiss if I did not inject a reminder that criticism or negative commentary directed at the purveyors of the subject Kit or their choice of subject will be treated as inappropriate should the commentary stray into escalation of the theme further.......
Our leisure pursuit of study and building replicas from a period of history is just that, history is what it was and confers no judgement nor support for the players nor events therein. I quote Dave (from Dubai) who has stated it so very well below; "At the end of the day they are plastic models, and the customer is free to choose what he or she is comfortable with."
Cheers, :)
Lance
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This Fokker was planned when the VIIF first boxing came out as part G3 (grab handle) is for this kit and was included in the original boxing (not used).
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I do understand Przemek's feeling very well...still would not be my choice at all. It is kind of feeling you know that causes immediate concern.
Sorry for my comment if you find it inappropriate
regards
K
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I, too, find it a most curious choice. It is really hard, in the end, to separate the consequent historical impact from the exploits in a previous era. I disagree, however, that this would somehow be a "stain" on our friends from NZ. They made a choice based on the historical impact of a particular aircraft. I think it's disingenuous to ascribe any "approval" of the later conduct. I can't for an instant imagine any of the folks associated with that particular company doing ANY such thing.
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I do understand Przemek's feeling very well...still would not be my choice at all.
Prez is opening a can of worms that the Moderator should close, especially given his (this site's) previously stated (explicit) position. Prez, with due respect, should have honored that position, as we honor his feelings.
Gene K
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Well Guys, I must say I saw this one coming as soon as I saw the announcement of the new Kit and Figure. I will shortly have to remove PrzemoL's last post as it violates Forum Rule 5, (private matters between supplier/trader and customer are not to be aired on the Forum) and later today I will be contacting Prze by PM to express my respect and hopefully achieve understanding of the action taken here.
I want to be clear that there is no malice nor disrespect intended in this action; it is being taken in the interests of harmony and the welfare of our very special association. Trust me, I fully understand that this release will be seen differently by each member and some may view it as a situation they don't wish to support and may even object to however that conflict must be worked out beyond the boundaries of the Forum. I hope all, and particularly the author of the post, will be understanding of the logic being employed here.
I believe we are a very special and fortunate group from around the globe who share a special interest and indeed bond of similar interests and values and do so despite many of history's less wholesome episodes. Every one of us is somehow a victim of conflicts of the past, my family like all of yours lived through the tragedies of the past which must remain behind us yet never be forgotten lest we err again.
The choice of whether or not to support this product lies with each individual. I would ask, however, that any objections to or debate of the product in question be restricted from the conversation here.
Lance
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Let me start off by saying I'm Jewish and I have some relatives in the camps during WW II. Two of my aunt's who are sisters, they married two of my grandmother's brothers also lost their parents in the camps. I've been a HUGE WW II aviatikn freak since I was around 5 years old, and I never had a problem with a swastika on a German aircraft I built as a child, nor did my grandmother or grandfather on a model. In fact, the first model I ever built was the Monogram Stuka, because my grandfather said they were a bad - mean aircraft, if that makes sense. I have only been into WW I aviation for about nine to ten years.
These new releases by Wingnut Wings don't interest me at all, really. But Goering was a famous pilot during the First World War and an ace, so I can see why they did his aircraft and figure. I myself would love to see them do one for Hans Bethge and his Pfalz D.IIIa's. While we may not all agree, we are all still family here on this forum and like any family we will always have disagreements, but we respect each other's opinions.
Lance, if I crossed the line here I sincerely apologize.
James Sontag
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On the Very positive side it is Nice to see the DVII F and the Snipe available again! Personally I don't need either but I know there are some that missed both!
RAGIII
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Nice to see the Snipe being rel-released ...it's on my wish list :)
Terri
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I was thinking for a long time if I should write here another comment or not. But without wanting to harm anybody I can say that I agree with Przemo and I would like to see WNW‘s answer to his e-Mail, if I may. I don’t want to increase tensions here, but I don’t want to leave Przemo without my support.
I know, Revell released Goering‘s Fokker in 1/72, Eduard did it in 1:48 in a Weekend Edition and there also was an Albatros D type fighter from a for me unknown manufacturer at the moment carrying Goering‘s markings afaik. So WNW are not the first to release the all white Fokker. And it‘s a simple color sheme that fits a policy to attract modelers who are afraid of difficult streaking and or Tarnstoff camouflage (additionally the D. VII is an „easy rigging“ plane). These and no other Motivs I can see in WNWs decision (as in Revell’s or Eduards) to release (another) white Fokker.
However, the things Goering did and what he stands for are simply despicable and I personally can’t neither separate the WWI flyer from the later war criminal. And I completely can understand and share the apprehension regarding a resin figure showing Hermann Meier standing in a heroic pose next to his aircraft.
Best regards
Andreas
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I just wish they had done Udet's candy-striper 'Lo!'
I know there are a few decals in one of the previous kits for another Lo, but the full treatment for 'Du doch nicht!' with options for black, red etc would have been nice - especially with a non-controversial little 1/32 resin Ernst to pose in front of it!
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I am in hospital for hip replacement surgery but I fully endorse Lance's stance toward this controversial Wingnuts release. I expect quite a few will privately convey their feelings directly to Wingnuts and this is how it should be done- not via forum posts.
Dave Wilson
Gold Coast
Australia
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"I expect quite a few will privately convey their feelings directly to Wingnuts and this is how it should be done- not via forum posts."
A very clear statement from the Owner/Administrator of our mutually enjoyed Forum Folks, and one I support. The Forum Rules are very clear in this regard and we all agree to follow them as a condition of Membership. I respect and yes, admire, the courage of convictions and principles intended here however those issues must be addressed outside of this venue. Any further comments or discussion of this subject from the perspective of the choice of subject matter of the product will of necessity be deleted.
Lance
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I would have preferred Udet for the DVIIF. Sure, Ernst had his difficulties.
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a couple of notes about the Goering release:
to my eye his pose doesn't look "heroic" he looks like an egotistical gasbag. he looks that way in the original photo. more than one account suggests some of his peers saw him that way.
to be an interesting subject for a model, it doesn't need to be 'heroic' or 'honorable' at least for me. it's more about 'this is a thing that happened. it should be, in some form, remembered, talked about.' to my eye the arc of WWI and the continuation is a tragedy not a heroic myth.
one could explain to people fascinated with the pretty white airplane, "he went on to be one of the worst people in the world, instrumental in screwing up the 20th century."
that said, i'm not interested in explaining. or building any ship of Goering's. i'll buy one and use the Karl Bolle decals from my other D.VIIF.
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... a little 1/32 resin Ernst to pose in front of it!
Ernst Udet was indeed a little figure -- at 5'3".
Gene K
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... a little 1/32 resin Ernst to pose in front of it!
Ernst Udet was indeed a little figure -- at 5'3".
Gene K
a 1/48 figure might work.
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Ernst Udet was indeed a little figure -- at 5'3".
a 1/48 figure might work.
Funny!!
Gene K
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He was a "sour Kraut", then?? ;D ;D
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Received this e-mail from Wingnut Wings: Interesting remarks on their recent product policy (Dr.I) and the FRENCH character of the Le Rhone motor of their latest in-developement-anouncement!
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That's very pointed, isn't it, the way they've put it?
It's a Hanriot! No...?!? ;)
And can we read into 'our first Austro-Hungarian aircraft' a suggestion that they intend more?
All good!
Mark
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I think the same
Banfields floatplane next I reckon
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That's very pointed, isn't it, the way they've put it?
It's a Hanriot! No...?!? ;)
And can we read into 'our first Austro-Hungarian aircraft' a suggestion that they intend more?
All good!
Mark
saw that.
cautiously optimistic on both counts.
sorry to comic Camel fans i'm pretty sure i jinxed it by predicting comic Camel.
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Here is the list and exact comments from WNW.
Other new models in development;
-32051 1/32 Handley Page O/100 – announced on 7 August 2019
-32068 1/32 Fokker F.1/Dr.1 (Early)* – announced on 7 August 2019
-32069 1/32 Fokker Dr.1 (Late)* – announced on 7 August 2019
-32075 1/32 New Model in Development (powered by a French LeRhone engine) – announced on 6 September 2019.
-32077 1/32 Hansa-Brandenburg D.1 – announced on 26 August 2019 (this will be our first Austro-Hungarian aircraft).
*We have long held the opinion that the very good 1/32 Roden model was good enough but we continued to be inundated with requests for a Wingnut Wings Fokker Triplane, so we have responded.
Note that they specifically State "Powered BY A French LeRhone engine" Not a French aircraft:
-32075 1/32 New Model in Development (powered by a French LeRhone engine) – announced on 6 September 2019.
So could be a Number of British aircraft I guess?
RAGIII
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HG or not, just like the BvR release, this allows us 'late to the party' to aquire these OOP kits without donating kidneys on ebay.
Ryan
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Note that they specifically State "Powered BY A French LeRhone engine" Not a French aircraft:
-32075 1/32 New Model in Development (powered by a French LeRhone engine) – announced on 6 September 2019.
So could be a Number of British aircraft I guess?
RAGIII
Perhaps this is referring to French 'built' Le Rhone, as opposed to a license produced engine from Germany, Sweden, England or even the US? Wiki.
Inferring that it would be installed in a French flagged airframe.
Thanks
Marcus
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Note that they specifically State "Powered BY A French LeRhone engine" Not a French aircraft:
-32075 1/32 New Model in Development (powered by a French LeRhone engine) – announced on 6 September 2019.
So could be a Number of British aircraft I guess?
RAGIII
Perhaps this is referring to French 'built' Le Rhone, as opposed to a license produced engine from Germany, Sweden, England or even the US? Wiki.
Inferring that it would be installed in a French flagged airframe.
Thanks
Marcus
Yes, it could be. I am not as informed on the powerplants for each aircraft type regarding whether it was license built or "French" built. So as a result I left the question Mark. For instance was the Comic Camel powered by a "French LeRhone" or a License built version? Same with the Strutter and others?
RAGIII
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I don't know.
I was thinking it could be something french flagged. A Nieuport or HD stands to reason it will have a French manufactured Le Rhone but even say, like a Strutter, they were a British design but the French flagged aircraft were license built in France in large numbers so (stands to reason in my mind, anyway) it would have had a French manufactured engine.
My thoughts.
Marcus
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Where did you guys find confirmation of the Comic Camel's engine? I've been doing a casual search for info for a year or more and have never found a clear statement on it. I think it was Bud's (Coyote Magic) conversion here that mentioned the LeRhone and I assumed it was the correct one from that point on. Even the classic Chaz Bowyer "King of Combat" book doesn't have any engine info. I'm thinking seriously of doing a conversion using the Wingnut Wings Kit however I think I'll hold off for now, Jeff may be correct on the pending release........ In the interim I'll just gather casual notes!
Cheers,
Lance
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I think the defining it as a French Le Rhône merely implies “not an oberursel.” In the kit sprues, the 9j has the option for s Le Rhône or Oberursel front plate. I think all we can surmise is that it will be an allied aircraft.
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A quick search using 'comic' or 'home defence' with 'Sopwith Camel' yielded a few sites where this was stated - GreatWar Forum has a thread where
multiple posters agreed the engine was a LeRhone, and a blog by Christopher Chant (cmchant.com), "Sopwith Camel - another classic British fighter of WW1", 20/06/2011, definitely states that comic Camels had a LeRhone 9J engine.
I don't know how definitive this is, but there seems to be a consensus.
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Thanks so much Ken, I'll enjoy reading those two refs and will include them in my notes for this, for now, tentative project!
Cheers,
Lance
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According to the Air-Britain Camel File all Camel night fighters had Le Rhone 9J engines although on checking individual serial numbers it often states "assumed Le Rhone".
Interestingly all the night fighters, either standard configuration or comic tank/seating configurations, were not built in batches but converted from standard production machines. So serial E5164 & 5165 for example were converted from a batch of 50 standard config F.1 planes (ordered under contract AS2166 from Portholme Aerodrome Company!)
From this I infer that the few Comics built were unlikely to all be exactly the same anyway, but it seems a safe bet to assume a Le Rhone.
My opinion FWIW.
Sandy
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So it looks like a Comic Camel would be a good bet considering the kit Number is in the Middle of the Camels 8)
RAGIII
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So it looks like a Comic Camel would be a good bet considering the kit Number is in the Middle of the Camels 8)
RAGIII
seeing as i guessed a comic Camel, and i've never been right so far, it'll probably be something else.
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Note that they specifically State "Powered BY A French LeRhone engine" Not a French aircraft:
-32075 1/32 New Model in Development (powered by a French LeRhone engine) – announced on 6 September 2019.
So could be a Number of British aircraft I guess?
RAGIII
Didn't Voss fit a French Le Rhone to his Fokker?