forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Under Construction => Scratch builds => Topic started by: NinetythirdLiberator on January 12, 2015, 06:23:59 AM
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Hello All,
I am building this guy for a Hyper Scale prototype GB but realized it certainly fits our WWI theme. The only trouble was should I put it in "Scratch" or "Vacform"? I decided here and we'll see how it goes.
I am making the masters from simple soft balsa with some success. Wings are "done" and I just pulled the fuselage. Wing tips will be added later...
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/009_zps13fe3e33.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2754_zpsfd5449a9.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2755_zpsc86d4a3b.jpg)
I think my stringers are bit obvious so I'll work on those a bit. But steady as she goes!
Thanks for looking,
Dan
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Looking forward to seeing progress on this model Dan, I have always been fascinated with the way in which vac form is done and seeing the different techniques is great. What you have done with the wing so far looks really good.
Des.
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Such an interesting and important airplane. Following with great interest.
PS -- I assume you are familiar with Mossie's CAD drawings that appeared in WWI Aero ?
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A terrific start to a very unusual(if important), subject! Looking forward to more progress!
RAGIII
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Wow...that was fast. Thanks for all the replies, Folks! :o :o
No, Bo...I am not familiar with that. I have pictures and a three view in the Harleyford Fokker book (and stuff from Google) but I am NOT familiar with the Aero publication. Any info would be appreciated.
I am stripping the plastic sprue for some thread as we type to try to get more subtle stringers in the fuse...
Thanks again, guys...Dan
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Is it okay to call an aeroplane adorable?
:)
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Here you go Dan: http://www.ww1aeroinc.org/
Another magazine I've always wanted to subscribe to.
Warren
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Just a bit more...
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2756_zpsbe223382.jpg)
The tails are just mocked up so you can see the overall proportions. It's amazingly straight and looks pretty nice. I'm making do with the fuselage and with a bit of filler and paint, I think it will be fine.
I'll work on turning the master for the cowl and spinner tomorrow night. Thanks for looking and all the great comments. This is a great discussion board! ;D ;D
Dan
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Only just found this one - this is a really interesting build. I am not a fan of vacuforms but you really are a master of them and this is a real gem. Could you provide more info on the Fokker as it is a type which I admit to knowing nothing about. I am going to follow this one closely.
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I hope Dan doesn't mind me butting in but I can tell you a little bit about the Fokker V.1. This was Fokker's first thick wing, cantilever biplane (sesquiplane to be precise), very advanced for its day (1916); it preceded the Dr.1 and D.VII, retrograde designs in comparison. There was a similar V.2 powered by an inline Mercedes, but the V.1 was more successful. Originally it had all-flying horizontal tail and finless rudder, also rotating wingtips in lieu of ailerons; the empenage evolved to a more conventional arrangement following feedback from frontline pilots who preferred the Albatros style tail. It never went beyond the experimental prototype stage, but was a stepping stone to the later successful thick-winged semi-cantilever designs, especially the D.VII and D.VIII.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/70/Fokker_V.1.jpg/1280px-Fokker_V.1.jpg)
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THAT'S the photo that got me thinking what a neat little model it would make. And the full flying surfaces and rotating wing tips will be fun to add to the model since they are kind of weird looking. That's part of the reason I left off the wing tips!
Please feel free to hijack any of this, Bo. I want to see you or Des make one in 1/32nd ;)
Cheers,
Dan
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THAT'S the photo that got me thinking what a neat little model it would make. And the full flying surfaces and rotating wing tips will be fun to add to the model since they are kind of weird looking. That's part of the reason I left off the wing tips!
Please feel free to hijack any of this, Bo. I want to see you or Des make one in 1/32nd ;)
Cheers,
Dan
Funny, I tried to get Des interested in it a while back (when he was working on his amazing Fokker Spin) -- just the contrast between the two planes by the same mfr just a few years apart -- but there is no rigging , so I guess not a lot of allure for our fearless leader :)
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neat plane, cant decide if i like this version or the one that has the albatros looking tail feathers.photos of this prototype preceed all discussions of fokker dr.1/d.vii in all the books i have. the first platz design for fokker i believe. love it. want to do one in 1/48 someday.
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Thanks for the information Bo. I think that it could be an interesting subject for a scratch build in the future when I have reduced the current waiting list a bit - no rigging does reduce the appeal a little though.
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All,
Well...I got the wing tip "ailerons" on, skinned the bottom of the wings, vacuformed a spinner and cowl and roughed in the cabanes. Looking mighty cool so far. The cowl, an extra little rotary engine and the spinner are just on with blue-tac right now.
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2762_zps50eacaa0.jpg)
Now I need to do some detail filling and sort out the landing gear. Then I'll prime and start painting. :D :D
Thanks for looking.
Dan
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That is looking really cool Dan, I like those little stumpy lower wings, sorta cute. I am starting to lean towards making one of these in 1:32 scale at some stage, it's growing on me.
Des.
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Looking absolutely great! I have been re reading the Imrie Dr1 book and this aircraft has several pages devoted to its role in developing the cantilever wing.
RAGIII
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This one is coming on really well. The detail so far looks very good.
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Thanks, all... ;)
Des: I do agree with others that this little plane lacks the things we like to do on this site like rigging. However, it's historical significance and lineage to the Tripe and even more to the D-VII and VIII...make it pretty interesting. I have a 1/72nd D-VII and now I want to make a triplane prototype, a production triplane and a D-VIII. They would make a cool family portrait all together.
Plus, you'd do your usual magic on it. You'd build it like I build my balsa and tissue planes: tubing frame and then formers and lots of stringers! Wings are an odd shape so they'd be a challenge. Moving tails and those wing tips are rather unique and really make the model. Not to mention the plywood (I think) covering on the wings and painting that would involve. I, for one, would love to see you tackle it.
No pressure... ;)
Cheers,
Dan
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It's a great build Dan, and so true about its importance. I lack the scratch-building skills to do this, but like you, I want to do a Dr.I prototype*, and show the lineage, etc.
Warren
* I had a friend on the WWI Modeling List that did one out of the Eduard kit and took it to the '05 IPMS Nats in Atlanta. It was a great jewel of a build.
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Thanks Dan, I will keep in mind what you said, even though a fairly basic aeroplane it would be a challenge as you are finding out.
Des.
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All,
I've primed this little guy, filled the worst offenders and repositioned the elevators and ailerons. I also got the sub wing and landing struts in place. As you see it here, the top wing is just sitting to check out alignment etc. It is acceptable. Wheels will go on later! This is all just to check the "sit".
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2776_zpsdd91d71b.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2775_zps9bc3b788.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2774_zps55e5cedd.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2773_zps0611a7b9.jpg)
Of course, I need to mock up a cockpit, but I'll just model it off of a triplane or similar. The pit is large enough that I think I can get something in there that will look ok.
I start painting the aluminum parts and plywood lifting structures tomorrow. I'm trying to find pictures of Fokker D-VIII wings to see what sort of plywood components and joints were employed. I assume they'd be pretty similar. Hooray!
Thanks for looking,
Dan
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Veeery nice build. Hope to see all the family three of it.
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Wow,Dan,you're doing a pretty good job on this little bug!!But tell me,how do you go along well with your wife while you both are sittin' at the living room table,she knits and you start burning some plastic ;)?
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Really starting to look the part now Dan, marvelous what a difference a coat of paint makes :)
Des.
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Dan, I have the highest respect for what you've done here. Like Warren I lack the skills to tackle such a build and I regret that because a whole new world opens when you are able to do so! So many a/c to be build that will never come out in a kit. Wonderful!
Kind regards
Patrick
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Very cool!
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Very fine project, Dan. I am watching it unveil with great interest. Little gem in the making!
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Outstanding progress! It looks like the V.1 now!!
RAGIII
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Lovely little bird Dan. Like Des wrote, a coat of paint and putting on the wings makes all the difference.
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All,
Here are the wooden parts painted up.
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2777_zpsfdcad0fe.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2778_zpsec0c021a.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2779_zpsdd7ceadb.jpg)
I can't believe the wing was just a plastic vacuform a few hours ago. It's fun to try and paint the white plastic to make it look
like plywood. :D :D :P :P
I don't know if this guy was really plywood covered, but the dark color on photos looks kind of like the front of a Gotha which is stated as being plywood. I also just saw a period photo of a Rumpler fighter having plywood parts on the fuse and this looks similar. Also...I figure Fokker wouldn't reinvent the wheel for the D-VIII wing so I'm pretending this is his first shot. The panel demarcations are pure fiction on my part based on D-VIII coverings I've seen.
Cheers,
Dan
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Looking really good Dan, remember the Fokker E.V had plywood covered wings skinned in panels.
Des.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-aCoo5hLHLP4/VL3atQHUcrI/AAAAAAAAP7A/ykzVA8TajEk/s800/Fokker%252520EV%252520x%25252055.jpg)
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The wing was plywood covered -- Fokker's innovation was combining the Junkers cantilever design with Forsmann's stressed plywood skin construction method...
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Looks perfect to my eyes! Ply covered for sure! Beautiful work on the painting!!
RAGIII
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Man! I wish I could paint plastic to look like plywood like that.
Warren
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Great paintwork Dan, it is real!
Kind regards
Patrick
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Coming along really well Dan , like the others have said . Beautiful work on the wood :)
Terri
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Totally agree about the wood finish. Would you consider painting some of my models……?
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All,
I painted the CDL parts and tried to weather or enhance them a bit. You can just see some of this on the rudder and stab. I just taped the ribs off and dusted with some pastels. In addition, the wheels are on. I still need some details, a cockpit, prop and touch up painting though.
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2782_zpsve1lwonp.jpg)
(http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee260/smithdr/IMG_2780_zpsuiek6zqc.jpg)
I like it a lot, but I am disappointed by the fuselage. I will live with it, but the next one will need to be way better. I am struggling with how to make it look intersting and shaded without accentuating the overdone stringers even more...oh, well.
There is always next time.
Thanks for looking...Dan
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Beautiful work replicating the wood on the wings, a very realistic look.
Des.
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Beautiful work, but I'm still not over that plywood. If you could share your method, I'd appreciate it very much.
Warren
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Thanks, everyone...
And Warren: Here is how I do that wood. :D
I just start with an overall light tan color and then mask off areas that I think were different panels just to add variety. These are sprayed with various shades of the original...both lighter and darker. After that it looks kind of dumb with too much contrast and like a patchwork quilt. :(
Then the fun starts...I just use raw umber oil and stipple it on in tiny specks with a brush or foam piece...whatever makes it look sort of random. Then I come back with a soft, broad brush that was dipped in thinner and wiped on a towel (so it's not super wet) and very gently go over the spots. I can pull them various ways, twirl around and keep playing with it until I get the right look. Then I give it some depth and a bit of color with a varied coat of clear orange. Kind of makes it "pop". It's fun to do.
As long as the base coat is acrylic, there are no worries and you can make lots of mistakes too.
Thanks for asking. Give it a try!
Dan
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Looking even more beautiful with the CDL on the fuselage! Your wood technique is simple but effective... VERY EFFECTIVE!
RAGIII
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Absolut great paint and work.
Martin
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Thanks, Martin, Warren, Des and Rick... ;)
I'm still thinking of what to do to make the CDL look a bit more interesting. I'll look for a prop and work on the cockpit while I'm thinking... ;D
Cheers,
Dan
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That is a lovely and very interesting little model - a little gem if ever I saw one. Very well done indeed.
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Dan,
thanks for the lesson, and yes, I'm going to try it. As for the CDL, Xan sure has done well with his on his 1/48th M-S build. It might provide you with ideas. Just sayin'.
Warren
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very nice progress.love it
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Lovely little bird
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I managed to miss this thread until it was four pages long. :o What a marvelous build, fantastic work.
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I too missed this until now, Dan. Neat little model and well done, some very nice work!
Cheers,
Lance
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Very well done Dan, nice looking bird. Wonderful modeling!
Kind regards
Patrick