forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
The David Wilson Memorial Group Build 2024 => The David Wilson Memorial Group Build 2024 => Topic started by: Dirigible-Al on May 02, 2024, 12:02:12 AM
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The LM boote of the Kaiserliche Marine were the forerunners of the later and better known S-Boats. During the Great War Germany, Like Britain, requisitioned many private and corporately owned boats for military and naval use (some of which are great subjects in their own right). Amongst the fishing boats, motor launches, yachts, passenger boats, barges and steamers to name but a few the motor boats pressed into service were to be used to destroy the submarine nets and other obstacles put along the coast of Flanders to stop U-boats getting into the open sea. These defences were patrolled by the Royal Navy and the German motor boats were too small to mount any significant weapon and had only their speed to protect them. By 1916 however not even this was sufficient and faster boats that were armed were needed both to carry out the work of the motor boats and be a threat to some of the patrolling anti submarine craft. The LM boote were built for this purpose and were capable of over 30 knots. Three Maybach CX straight six engines drove three propellers, the engines used in airships hence the name. The first production batch LM1-6 had four boats armed with a 37mm cannon and two with 450mm torpedo tubes. The latter had the torpedoes bow mounted, a disadvantage being they couldn't be fired above the speed of 20 knots or they could run into them (and that could end very badly). These entered service in 1917. The second batch LM7-21 were all torpedo armed. The third and final production batch LM22-33 were to have two armed with cannons to replace two lost and the rest torpedoes but not all were completed due to the Armistice. They were manufactured by Nalgo, Roland, Friedrich Lurssen and Oertz. Probably the most notable action by the LM boote was when seven of them raided a group of ships anchored off Dunkirk during the night of August 22-23, 1917. Two torpedoes stuck a destroyer leaving it on fire and listing heavily but remaining afloat.
I am just finishing one project and was about to crack on with the Praga I have, with embarrassment, not touched for a while despite starting a thread. The poor old Praga will have to wait a bit longer now. Six months is one hell of a challenge for me as I am probably the slowest modeller on the site but I will try. There's very little information on the LM Boot so if anyone has any further information, in particular photos or pictures, they would be really appreciated. So far I have made photocopies of the GA's and next I will built a plastic card and filler hull. Sorry it's not a Pfalz or SE5a but I hope Dave would like it all the same if he were to be ably to see it where he is now.
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This is fascinating and I'm sure Dave would approve :)
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Fascinating is exactly the word I was thinking too. Really looking forward to this :)
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Very interesting project! I'm looking forward to this one ;D
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Unusual and interesting subject. I look forward to your build.
RAGIII
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What a cool subject! Looking forward to seeing this one progress!
Cheers,
BC
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Thank you for your comments Nigel, William, AJ, Brad and RAGIII. I started cutting out a skeletal frame for the hull with the intention of then filling it but then considered that is a bit nuts on something this small. Instead I turned to an old and trusted friend - dense foam. I carved the hull out using templates from the plans and sanded it the same way. Dense foam has it's problems, it is very easy to over sand it because its very soft and once that is done there is nothing you can do to rectify it. The deck is slightly domed which is common on MTB's but not as much as the Thorneycrofts and MAS boats, this will make skinning it with plasticard either hard or impossible so I need to figure out a solution to that (part of the cockpit is covered by the deck). Next job is to cut out the cockpit and the torpedo tube tunnel, then I can soak the foam in superglue to make it possible to stick things too it.
Thanks for looking in, Alan.
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Fantastic Start!
RAGIII
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This is an unusual and interesting subject. I will be following with much interest.
Stephen.
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Great start, and soooo small!
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Great progress! Looks very interesting! ;D
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Thanks for your comments RAGIII, Ben and Stephen. Nigel, it is 11.1cm long so although that is really small for a 1/144 naval subject it is about the same length as some 1/48 aircraft fuselages but I have to confess 1/72 would be a better scale for this.
I've not got much further but thought I would update anyway because I will be doing a fair bit of painting, polishing back, painting, polishing back again, painting ect until it is glass smooth. This will take time.
I cut out the cabin and in doing so went so close to the edge the walls were actually semi transparent and I could see the scalpel behind them. I white glued two cardboard guides to sand the groove for the torpedo tube. The tool I used was a lollipop stick with sandpaper glued around it. I found a pen refill that is the right size for the torpedo tube. This was cut to shape and the hole in the middle made bigger by glueing sandpaper around an extra big paperclip and running it inside.
I found that to make dense foam hard and sand-able it needs a very thinned coat of varnish then a normal coat once that has soaked in. After this has dried a coat of superglue and it becomes a different beast altogether. The varnish goes on first because otherwise the superglue applicator will pull lumps out of the foam. I thought I would skip the varnish on this because it is so small it would take seconds to put the glue on, not enough time to cause any mischief. I was wrong, the applicator pulled chunks out of the foam and deposited bits of those chunks elsewhere on the boat which instantly set. The biggest chunk was on the bow where the torpedo tube ends and the dense foam is at its thinnest. All this I can fix without carving another hull but it does involve a fair bit of filler and sanding. I would have needed to do some painting and sanding anyway as the surface is always a little rough.
Thanks for looking in, Alan.
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Goodness, that's a lot of work. You are reminding me why I like building kits...... But keep going, this will be fascinating to watch it all come together.
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Nigel, I have the ability to make cock ups of the same magnitude in both kits and scratch builds. The annoying thing about this is I needn't of bothered with making guide rails and a custom built file when I have ended up bunging loads of filler in it in the end. I put tape around the waste end of the pen refill I am using for the torpedo tube and shoved the filler around that. Now I just have to wait for it to harden.
Alan.
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I am always amazed at the processes in scratch building! I look forward to seeing the processes come together!
RAGIII
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Not the most exciting thing but I thought I would show the base. Insulating foam was cut and sanded to shape. I then scrunched up some baking foil and stretched it very the foam. This was covered in white glue and green painted on the high parts and blue on the low ones. Next I put Many layers of varnish with a tiny drop of darker blue mixed in with the intention of giving it depth. The raised parts will have cotton wool glued to them to resemble foam but I cannot do this until the boat is glued into it.
Thanks for looking in, Alan.
NB: pictures are in the wrong chronological order.
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I have never tried doing water other than a puddle on an armor diorama. I look forward to seeing your results!
RAGIII
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Tinfoil for water...what a clever idea! It looks great!
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Well done on the project! Base looks like a fun project too! The waves came out very nice :)
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Nice work on the base. I've always been tempted by ships and the allure of doing a seascape but so far I've never got round to it.
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Thank you for your comments RAGIII, KiwiZac, AngryJazz and Nigel.
I didn't invent the foil technique, I checked out UTube videos and thought this was the most practical and time effective method: https://youtu.be/aoAaodEqO0g?si=0bKtZN0LQG3hxKQo
Progress has been slow on the boat but I have worked on the crew. Although there are 7 crew members I don't think all of them would be on the deck at the same time and I opted for 3. These are 3d printed NeOmega figures which I sprayed white then brush painted the skin and hair. Uniform was painted in WW2 Panzer grey and given 2 washes of thinned black. Flesh and hair was washed with thinned brown. The commander 'Long John Silver' lost a leg when I clamped him in order to be painted. Somehow the clamp shot him like a bullet in one direction and his leg in another. I found Long John Silver under the radiator but to my amazement, after an hour's worth of unsuccessful looking, I found LJS's leg in the dustpan after sweeping the carpet later. I will attach it at the last minute in case it propells itself across the room again.
Thanks for looking in, Alan.(https://i.imgur.com/ibPfQ1i.jpeg)
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Excellent work on those Tiny figures!
RAGIII
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Great idea to add figures, they really make a ship model come to life. And even better with a full complement of legs.....
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Cheers RAGIII and Nigel, I had to have figures because it gives the proper idea of scale (as well as not looking daft racing across the water with no one in it!). I have put together the only open part of the boat. I must say this is at the limit of what I can do in this scale. Some of the stuff I made got lost one way or another due to size and had to be made again. Pretty much every time I put something on I knocked something off. I needed three pairs of glasses including one with a jeweler's loop attached. Even when I finished the control board the jeweler's loop fell off and landed on the dam thing and broke the throttles again. I was going to make another smaller board on the port side of the helmsman but thought I should quit while I am ahead. Almost all of the interior is speculative anyway, the only exceptions are the rudder wheel and post it is in, the compass above it and the two very small seats in the back. I looked at many motorboats of that era and concluded this is a realistic layout. I felt there had to be either a door or open entrance into the bow otherwise no one could get in there for repairs. Similarly I felt there had to be a door behind them connecting to the rest of the boat. The plank effect was done by pencilling it on paper cut to size, painting over it and glueing in place. The compass and dials were fuse wire wrapped around a paper clip then cut lengthwise to produce many circles. These were glued onto shrunken photocopies I made of dials. The switches are just stretched sprue pushed through small pre drilled holes. The fire extinguisher is a Bic pen cartridge heat stretched, painted silver and with a piece of PE sprue cut to shape and inserted in it. The throttles were the sleeve of small circuit wire cut into crescents and glued onto the control board with gaps between them. Into the gaps I glued about 1.5 mm lengths of fuse wire with tiny blobs of extra thick acrylic paint on the ends. Map/instructions pad is a small square of paper with silver paint run along the edge. The steering wheel was a large PE gun sight from the spares box. On looking at the pictures now I think I will re do the back door so it looks sharper but I am done with building for a couple of days.
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Thanks for looking in, Alan.
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Really amazing scratch-built details. I found Myself thinking about how tiny this really is, then saw the Bottle Cap photos! WOW!
RAGIII
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Fantastic detail work! And I enjoyed reading about your trials and tribulations...... :) I have had many of the same issues (like the removable lenses from my head worn magnifier falling out and on to the model....).
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Thanks for your comments RAGIII and Nigel, one day I might scratch built a 12" diameter bottle cap then it will be easier to make and display small details. I covered the deck with paper cut from the GA's and this has covered up the groove edge made for the torpedo tube. It should have covered part of the cockpit but it looked out. I couldn't understand why as I measured it enough times and finally cut it as per the GA's glued on. On inspection of the drawings before they were shrunk to scale I saw that they are a little skew whiff. There is a metal armoured plate that goes around the open cockpit and I hope to fudge the difference under this. Lesson learned, GA's are great but should not be unquestionably trusted. The structure behind the cockpit (engine room) is carved from balsa but will require a lot more work. I managed to make a couple of funnels. After hunting thru my wire stash I found a sleeved wire that was the same diameter as the GA's. The wire was taken out, it was cut at 45*, superglued together and widened at the top with a heated drill bit. The rough bits have been plastered with thick paint in order to be sanded and cut to shape (it is difficult to sand this stuff because it just goes fluffy so sharpening it up will take a lot longer than making it in the first place).
Thanks for looking in. Alan
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I just love following scratchbuilding threads, the ingenuity you have to possess is a true gift, and this one showcases that fact better than most... pen-refill torpedo tubes and a tinfoil sea. Looking forward to seeing this little gem finished!
Dutch
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The processes are always great to watch! Looking forward to your further progress!
RAGIII
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Wow, more amazing work and great problem solving. This is a lot of work for a tiny model!
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Thanks for your comments Dutch, RAGIII and Nigel, it helps hearing positive feedback when I get punished by my worst critic, myself. I was hoping to post this with more stuff done but things have not been moving fast on my workbench.
I decided to re do part of the funnels. On the plans it shows a lip near the top and widens slightly. I chopped off the bottoms, inserted a narrow sleaved wire into the hollow funnel and widened this to the desired amount. This was done by wrapping tin foil around the thinner bottom. I love using foil, it is super thin, can be sanded and usually leaves little or no line where it ends.
The deck was painted with Panzer grey and to my releaf it covered both deck and cockpit OK with no rips or creases. The armour around it was heat moulded .25mm plastic card which after 3 goes I was happy with the result. A bit of tidying up is now needed.
Engine room is just a solid piece of balsa. I could have had hatches open but that would have meant building it out of plastic card and would have taken much longer. There appears to be two large 'sunroof' style raised sections which I believe to have small struts or catches connecting them to the roof of the engine room. I used the thinnest fuse wire I have to replicate this, although I put these right through them you will not know that. The tops of these are paper cut from the plans as are the hatches that open. These had to be raised above the level of the vents (otherwise they wouldn't look like they could open!) which I did using plastic card.25mm. More detail will go on these. The 8 portholes are the same fuse wire wound round a drill bit and cut lengthwise to form circles. Since doing these I thought thin heat stretched sprue wound round a drill bit and heated would have been better, maybe next time. They will be filled with gunmetal grey and then high gloss.
I have just placed the engine room on the deck and will glue it when I have finished more of the details. I am somewhat relieved the main parts are nearly done even if not attached. I am now in that place where 90% is done and just have the other 90% to go!
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Thanks for looking in, Alan.
Edit: I accidentally deleted the pictures on this post on Imgur. I hope now the correct ones are back.
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Amazing! This is really taking shape now! Excellent techniques used to form the parts. Not too fancy but very effective!!
RAGIII
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Good to see you progressing with this. It will be worth the effort to have such a unique model of such an interesting subject.
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Excellent work! ;D
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Great project
Sandy
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I deleted some rubbish off of Imgur and in doing so accidentally deleted some of the pictures to which there are links here. I think I got them all but in re posting them I somehow did another post, this one. I deleted all the text (which was basically all from the last post) and thought I may as well fill it with an update. Good job I don't do IT for a living!
Thanks for your comments Sandy, Angry Jazz, Nigel and RAGIII.
I have not made anything new but simply attached the built parts to the boat. It is now at a point where handling it is precarious and dropping it would undo a lot of work so I have now glued it to it's permanent home. Before I attached it to the base I masked then brush painted the anti fouling on the hull. I am not happy with the edge where the deck meets the sides so I will tidy that up a bit. I will then have all the finicky little details to add.
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Thanks for looking in.
Alan
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That is a great update...intentional or not 8) she really is looking the part, especially in it's natural environment!
RAGIII
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Great progress, she looks completely believable on that base. What an amazingly effective technique!
Dutch
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She's really looking like a boat now! I really like the different colours in the water, very effective. This is a really interesting build, I'm enjoying it very much
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Thanks for your comments RAGIII, Dutch and Nigel.
I am tackling the hardest things now which is why there's been a long time since my last post. I have been working on this to no lesser extent but I just have not been able to move this on as quick as I would have wanted to.
I think the railings are really important because they give a proper idea of scale. I used the thinnest copper wire I dared, I couldn't use the thinnest I have because it would just be too flimsy. Using a cutout of the plans I put the verticals in place. The wire was straitened then sharpened at one end like a needle, this was then just stuck into the foam body and glued. When fixed I was able to bend them at the base to their correct angle. For the horizontals I tried a thinner wire on the top of but wasn't happy with it so mono went on. For the middle horizontal I tried mono again but struggled so used stretched sprue and that worked well. Although time consuming it didn't give me any real problems until I did the last bit, one of the diagonals on a corner and cut through something I shouldn't. This unfortunately put me into a rut where every time I put one piece on I broke another somewhere else. Other times it just refused to go in place, instead choosing to stick itself to something it shouldn't. I finally put the corner together, it doesn't look exactly like the others but I don't want to go back on myself and re build the whole side again besides which that may be impossible, although foam is great to build with it can have its drawbacks. If you glue something into it then take it out a large piece of foam usually accompanies it.
The MG08 machine gun was made from three small strips of .25mm plastic card with part of the handles cut into the ends of two. The middle has a notch cut out of it to house part of the barrel. The sides were sanded thinner after they were glued together. The barrel is a very thin piece of PVC electrical sleeving hollowed out then filled with one rod of copper. The copper rod protrudes out one end to slot into the notch in the middle piece of plastic card. Small, cut pieces of plastic, paper and stretched sprue went around the gun to detail it. Finally two very small pieces of stretched sprue finished off the rear handles. I ended up making three of these. Number one and two are missing somewhere in the carpet or god knows where. I did actually find the magazine from #2 so only made two of them, this was cut and shaped from a thick piece of plastic sprue. If this one decides to launch itself across the room I probably won't build another one.
Base of the MG is made almost entirely of copper wire glued together. There appears to be a barrel type part near the top, I heat stretched a pen refill and cut a little piece off. By doing this I was able to slide it down the piece of copper that attaches to the MG and works well both to stabilise and strengthen it.
Despite the issues which were all of my making I am happier it now looks like a speedboat with the railings on rather than a vessel that could be of any scale. I will now move onto the fiddly bits on the front.
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That is really impressive work on something that must be very fiddly and delicate!
/Fredrik
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Amazing work and the end result is very effective. Well worth the effort!
All these 1/144 scratchbuilds are just convincing me to stick with gluing together big kits in 1/32!! :D
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Amazing work and the end result is very effective. Well worth the effort!
All these 1/144 scratchbuilds are just convincing me to stick with gluing together big kits in 1/32!! :D
I have to agree with Nigel!
It was great following your processes during the build! Those railings are mind blowing when I think about just how Small they are in reality! Lovely results!!
RAGIII
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Thank you for your comments RAGIII, Nigel and Fredrik it can be fiddly, frustrating and very time consuming to put some of these things on but I do think they are worth the effort in the end.
I had a good session this morning, got stuck and so as not to spoil things quit while I was ahead.
There is a rectangular box which is part of the wireless aperatus and connects to the aerial. Rather than use a drill to fit the turnbuckle I found a strip of plastic already cut from 1mm plastic card and ran the point of a scalpel down the middle to make a groove. I then cut two small pieces off the end and glued them together with the turnbuckle in the grooves.
I did some of the work on the torpedo tube hatch. Two turnbuckles went into the tube. It took a few attempts to get the wire through them without bending it but I got there in the end. I initially heat moulded the tube cover on the end but it looked too clunky but in a moment of inspiration I folded the picture on the GA's over and cut through the two layers. Paper is like plastic when it is soaked in oil based paint or varnish so I did this and it is now set into it's shape.
The two masts are copper filed down to a taper and the bases are the pvc sleeving around the copper wire found in circuits. These were glued in place with a fair length going below the deck. I tried to make the aerial that runs between them them but despite them being quite deep in the hull the foam is not very forgiving and the two masts bend towards each other when under any kind of strain. This leaves mono and elastic out. There are actually two wires that run between them attached to the masts by two traingles. I started trying to do them with stretched sprue but had no luck then with copper wire. In both cases I couldn't glue them to the right shape or get them straight but thought it best to quit before I got flustered and accidentally broke something. Worst case scenario is if I can't do this I could run a single wire between them but I would prefer to do it the proper way.
Thanks for looking in, Alan.
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Wow. Lovely scratchbuilding.
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More unbelievable Tiny details being scratch built! Amazing!!
RAGIII
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You are doing an excellent scratch job. Just lovely.
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Thank you everyone for your support and interest during this build, it is really appreciated. I now have all the parts on this and all it needs now is a good clean up before posting on the completed section.
The antenna was a lot harder than I anticipated and it is the reason it has taken me so long to get to this point. I initially tried wire, then PE turnbuckles with EZ line, then PE turnbuckles with EZ line / wire combo, then stretched sprue heat moulded around a former and finally back to wire for another two attempts. I built a card guide between the masts and it fixed itself to two turnbuckles nicely. Although I think this is the most accurate looking way it is the most fragile and one touch will bend it beyond repair, I just hope that doesn't happen.
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I carefully cut out some 1/144 3d printed rope posts and cleaned them up only to find they were too big for a MTB. I made new ones using paper hardened with varnish, small cuts of .25mm plastic card and on top slightly thicker paper. For their size I am pleased with the outcome.
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Flag is made using a photocopier to shrink two images and stick them back to back. Post is copper wire with a small cross section of fuse wire sleeving at the base.
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Spot lights are a biro refill heat stretched into shape. I then painted them silver and filled the cavity with resin. They were finished off with a coat of grey. Although this worked I think it was wasted on 1/144 scale, still, I think it looks better than one with the front just painted silver to represent glass.
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The torpedo was a piece of sprue put in a drill chuck and spun like a lathe so I could sand it both round and the correct diameter using a homemade 'L' shape sanding tool. The bull nose and tapered tail were done a similar way. The whiskers on the nose are four pieces of bent wire. The fins are plastic card and the rest of the details are just painted on. Smoke from the launch charge is cotton wool as is the froth from the wake of the boat. A peculiar thing happened to the cotton wool. The CW in the sea turned a grey yellow for some unknown reason while the CW around the torpedo stayed brilliant white despite them both being secured with white glue. I ended up painting most of the CW in the sea white. The CW around the torpedo still looked silly being brilliant white compared to the sea foam. I have coloured this before using black felt tip pen then leaving it on the window sill for the sun to fade to the right colour but I don't have time or the weather to do this now. The solution was to grind some pastels, the correct colours, into powder and rub the CW into it.
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There is a peculiar shape object on the port bow with an eyelet at it's rear end. I was not sure what this was and even thought it might just be unique to that particular boat. The penny finally dropped Monday, it secures the mast when it's dropped. I am guessing there is only one and not two side by side by the picture. I first made it out of paper (pictured) but then re made it with .25mm plastic card because the paper one wouldn't stick to the deck unless it was on its side or bent.
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Although I was pleased with the railings when initially made for some reason the top rail has buckled. This is made out of mono so I heat shrunk it with a punk. A few days ago I noticed that it buckled again. I have come to the decision to leave it as it is for now because if I try to heat shrink it again and instead melt it (and I have done that in the past) I will not have time to repair it before the deadline. I am in fact terrified that at this stage I will drop it or drop something on it. I will repair the railings but later in my own time.
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A few notes on accuracy. Although I think I have most of it right and have included more bits than the two other builds I have seen of this there are a couple of errors. There is a band going around the top of the hull just below the deck line. Due to stupidity this band is way too deep. The deck, though curved, is too curved on the edges. This is down to how I made it and to rectify this I would have had to build the whole thing again. The two parallel lines on the antenna could possibly have been further apart. There may be rigging lines attaching the masts to the deck although not permanent as they are designed to fold / come out. The interior is entirely made up except for the compass visible in front of the wheel and the hatch opening mechanism which comes down from the torpedo tube. The magazine on the MG08 is from an Army MG08, although this may be correct for all I know, looking back it probably would have been better to just leave it off. If anyone else sees anything missing or wrong please say, I won't be insulted. If someone looks at this for reference I wouldn't like them to include one of my misdemeanours.
Once again thank you all for following this build.
Alan.
Edit: better pictures now in the completed models section https://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=14647.0
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That looks absolutely fantastic, what a clever and imaginative setting. Definitely well worth all the effort. Those final details are amazing, well done!
As for accuracy, I wouldn't have spotted your misdemeanours if you hadn't told me..... ;)
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This has turned out great. I really like it…. Well done! While I can’t imagine scratch building at this scale, I keep being tempted by the 1/144 Steam Drifter by neo omega, especially after looking at your torpedo boat.
Cheers
Matt
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I was stumped for second - ”why would he put the torpedo dangling on a stick like th…. ooooh”
Great little model, very pleased to see a boat too.
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Thanks Torbiorn,
Matt, you will find the NeOmega Resin Drifter here https://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=14484.0
And the build log on Cher Ami volume 13/2 here https://sites.google.com/site/greatwarsig/Resources?authuser=0
Nigel, you did say that dioramas should tell a story so this one does.
I bit the bullet, held my breath an fixed the warped railings. Fortunately it went well without destroying anything. Finished pictures will now be found on the Completed Models Page.
Alan.
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Nigel, you did say that dioramas should tell a story so this one does.
I did indeed, and this definitely does. And I just twigged that Dirigible-Al is none other than Alan Pask himself ;) Hi Alan!
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Hi Nigel.
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Lovely action scene with the model ;D
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Thanks for the links - I think I’ll have to indulge! Perhaps a Xmas pressie to myself.
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Thanks Angry Jazz. Just one extra thing re NeOmega Matt, I wish now I had got the Eppleton Hall paddle tug they sell. If I had bought it I would have converted it into an armed paddle tug which would have been easy.
Alan.
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Just remarkable, wow!