forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com

WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Under Construction => Topic started by: xan on January 16, 2024, 08:29:08 AM

Title: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on January 16, 2024, 08:29:08 AM: After three years my SPAD are back again!
You can see there the begining:
https://1914.forumactif.com/t441-spad-vii-et-xiii-debut-de-serie-avions-d-herbelin-de-pinsard-et-de-de-turennes-jmgt-special-hobby-eduard-1-48 (https://1914.forumactif.com/t441-spad-vii-et-xiii-debut-de-serie-avions-d-herbelin-de-pinsard-et-de-de-turennes-jmgt-special-hobby-eduard-1-48)
or here shorter:
https://master194.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=125871 (https://master194.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=125871)

So let's go first with the Special Hobby:

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/8711.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/8811.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/8915.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: DaddyO on January 16, 2024, 06:21:42 PM: Some lovely work already on these Xan.

I hadn't realized how time consuming working on several versions of the same aircraft at the same time was until I tried it, but these should be beauties when completed - keep going ;D

Paul
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on January 16, 2024, 09:14:19 PM: JMGT turn now...
done! three of them have wings!

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9012.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9112.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9212.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: Dutch522 on January 16, 2024, 09:47:34 PM: Magnifique! (sorry, I don't know how to say it in Basque :D ) I bought the 1:32 Roden SPAD VII a few months ago with the express intention of building the "Golden Panther" version of Pinsard's machine, so I'll be following along with great interest.

Dutch
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: WD on January 17, 2024, 12:23:51 AM: It's really nice to see you posting again here Xan! Your SPAD's are looking wonderful!

Warren
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on January 17, 2024, 07:32:10 PM: Quote from: Davos522 on January 16, 2024, 09:47:34 PM
Magnifique! (sorry, I don't know how to say it in Basque :D
Easy: Bikaina, itzela or ikusgarria!

Quote from: Davos522 on January 16, 2024, 09:47:34 PM
I bought the 1:32 Roden SPAD VII a few months ago with the express intention of building the "Golden Panther" version of Pinsard's machine.
Gold yellow or white?

in this picture panther seems to be white kighter than wings color...

(http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Photos4/078_Pinsard_Negro.jpg)

Yellow apperence could be old varnish effect... I am not sure yet.

(http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Insignes/078_Entoilage_Pinsard.jpg)

Xan
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: NigelR on January 17, 2024, 07:42:27 PM: Lovely work on a challenging kit. And JMGT! That brings back memories.... I remember when we were amazed by these kits when they were first released.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: Dutch522 on January 17, 2024, 11:11:25 PM: Xan

Interesting! I was of course going by David Méchin's profile of S.VII No 406 on Albin Denis's site:

(https://i.postimg.cc/BvLjMW1S/IMG-4672.jpg)

... but was No. 406 also the same aircraft as the photo you posted showing Pinsard in "Revanche III"? If so then I think your theory is correct, since the léopard de Bornéo certainly appears to be white.

I'll be following with even more interest to see what your conclusions are!

Dutch
(who walked through the Basque country on the Camino de Santiago, and formed a great liking for the people, and particularly their wonderful Akerbeltz beer! :) )
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: Borsos on January 19, 2024, 05:47:31 PM: Very nice progress on your three SPADs!
Andreas
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on January 25, 2024, 11:42:18 PM: I lost this part... no problem with a good drawing and a plotter, SPAD XIII empennage is done too

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9412.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9511.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9613.jpg)

Cool! the three SPAD are at the same point...
It is timeme now to work around the struts, and there is a lot of work ....

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9714.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: PrzemoL on January 26, 2024, 08:58:32 AM: Lovely triple build, Sir.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: NigelR on January 26, 2024, 07:07:57 PM: Excellent progress, looking forward to seeing all three develop.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on January 31, 2024, 08:48:37 AM: Hi and thanks for the commments.
About the Special hobby SPAD VII struts now:

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/9912.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10013.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10112.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on February 01, 2024, 05:58:26 PM: I give up for the white metal JMGT, there ara definitively too large...In stead of them, I will use Eduard SPAD XIII strutsfrom a week-end box I bought to use some parts.

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10313.jpg)

I will do the n°406, the Revanche III his third lack fuselage SPAD, with a panther, SPA78 squadron symbol

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10610.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/078_en11.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/morcea10.jpg)

three years ago, this fabric part was sold in a caution and this video was done: a treasure for us!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDpFQQFnAgY&t=9s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDpFQQFnAgY&t=9s)

I will use pure lack for metal and wooden parts, radôme (H318) for fabric (wormer than sail color H84 in my opinion) and a mix of them for black painted fabrics

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10511.jpg)

Xan
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: KiwiZac on February 02, 2024, 08:37:58 AM: Excellent work Xan, and a fascinating comparison of the kits.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on February 02, 2024, 08:01:50 PM: Going on with a choise to make .

th 406's panther is always represented in beige or golden color:
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/pinsar11.jpg)
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/25158210.jpg)
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/spad_v10.jpg)

because of this, of course...
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/078_en13.jpg)
The only picture oof the palne is driving me mad...
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/118.jpg)
The panther seems to be white while the wings, fabric colo for sure, are clearly in an another shade...
We have not to trust evidently theose old pictures, even more in that bad resolution, but....
In this video it seems to be really yellow, and the otther at the side is till white despite the pasted time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdp4OVyxqDk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdp4OVyxqDk)
so I tried both options

masling first for the back ground
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10710.jpg)

and printed decals
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10810.jpg)
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/10911.jpg)

any opinions ?
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: PrzemoL on February 02, 2024, 08:21:48 PM: Seeing the original photo I would go for the white panther.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: NigelR on February 03, 2024, 06:40:28 PM: I agree, the white looks closer to the original picture.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: KiwiZac on February 05, 2024, 08:35:59 AM: Another vote here for white! Gold looks cool, but the photo makes it a clear choice to me.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: Dutch522 on February 05, 2024, 02:25:50 PM: I don't know, I kind of like the ivory vs. the white, but I still have that lovely gold panther stuck in my mind...

Dutch
PS - that has to be an Aéronavale Corsair, n'est-ce pas...? :D
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on February 06, 2024, 09:15:24 PM: I was not sure at all but two new arguments make my choice more sure:
First we have the rudder fabric part: the white of the flag is quite yellowish two and we know for sure it was white...

But more important. Marc Chassard remind me one thing:
most of WW1 pictures are orthochromatic pictures.
In those films, yellox appears very dark, as we con see in those N88 squadron pics.
Those planes weare a yellow /black/yellow stripes.
This is how they appear:

(http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Photos4/088_Nieuport_4585.jpg)

(http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Photos3/088_Coadou_Judex.jpg)

(http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escadrille/Photos3/088_Coadou_Nieuport.jpg)

I made my choise Panther will be white...

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/118.jpg)

Xan
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on February 08, 2024, 07:09:14 PM: first the back ground:
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/12210.jpg)
the, the decals:
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/12311.jpg)

and for the fun:
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/12410.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/119.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: PrzemoL on February 08, 2024, 07:19:38 PM: Lovely, Xan!
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: NigelR on February 08, 2024, 07:28:50 PM: That's looking really good. I think you made the right choice.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: andonio64 on February 08, 2024, 09:35:46 PM: Great work as usual Xan, looking at the fragment you showed I would have gone for a linen colour, as it was painted just the black outline and inside lines.
The fragment seems to me shows the linen color on some parts where the dirt does not cover the shape.
But looking at the B/W photos and comparing the color of the panther with the wing surfaces it appears too different!
Probably white is the right choice, although I like more the beige solution!!! ;D
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: KiwiZac on February 09, 2024, 08:04:28 AM: That's coming together very nicely Xan, well done!
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: WD on February 12, 2024, 01:33:49 AM: Sorry to be late at coming back to this wonderful thread.

Xan, you beat me to it, as I was scrolling I was remembering about ortho film and what it does to yellows, blues, etc. and was going to bring up about the yellow going dark. As much as I love the golden/yellow panther, like you white it should be.

I'm really loving this build thread, beautiful work all around on one of my favorite a/c.

Warren
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: Tim Mixon on February 12, 2024, 09:52:54 PM: Very nicely done Xan. You have made a beautiful rendering of the original artwork. Personally I like the white panther as it contrasts against the beige wings.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: xan on February 19, 2024, 07:33:26 PM: Hi all!
The only picture I know of the n°406 give us quite information about the plane configuration.

1) Machine gun was equiped with Le Chrétien gunsight wich clearly appears in the pic.
2) This SPAD had a traditional windscreen (a lot of them had transformed win screen due to the hardness to rearm the vickers)
3) The propeler is not that clear, but it can e a Levasseur neither a Chauvière.
surely a Eclair or a Gallia wiich had similar form

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/12510.jpg)

For the machine gun I have that:

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/12811.jpg)

but finaly I used the part photoetched and some evergreen piece.

(https://i43.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/13610.jpg)

Find the wind scrrn was not so evident:

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/13510.jpg)

but right now this zone is done (leather + windscreen + MG)

(https://i43.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/13212.jpg)

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/19/98/05/33/13312.jpg)
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: NigelR on February 20, 2024, 07:10:12 PM: Lovely work on the machine gun, it looks fantastic on the plane.
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: pepperman42 on February 21, 2024, 12:37:53 AM: Just catching up. This is looking great!

Steve
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: WD on February 26, 2024, 09:36:02 AM: This is just gorgeous.

Warren
Title: Re: SPAD VII and early XIII Herbelin, Pinsard and de Turennes
Post by: KiwiZac on February 26, 2024, 03:38:55 PM: Hear hear. Your work to correct the guns is terrific, and the aircraft is shaping up so nicely. This thread is a real joy to follow.