forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Hints and Tips/Questions about modeling => Topic started by: masterKamera on June 13, 2022, 02:00:52 PM
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WHy is it that the reviews never seem to mention ISSUES with the parts in the kits?
Ive seen a few builds that were 'this seam didnt line up right on this plane", but never anything like the alignment issues ive just discovered on my airfix eindecker?
i discovered that .4mm pins do not go well with 1mm holes for them to fit into,, the halves really cant be glued to eachother without one being glued to the bottom plate with seat installed, that the wall behind the pilots seat is not actually the correct dimensions on the top... that the sides dont attach correctly due to that plate being installed,,, that there is no actual way to locate where the right place to attach the bottom to either side plate.
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Have you taken this matter up with Airfix? And which reviews are you referring to?
Dave Wilson
Gold Coast
Australia
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WHy is it that the reviews never seem to mention ISSUES with the parts in the kits?
Inbox reviews - what I prefer to call kit previews - rarely feature the reviewer taking the time to dry-fit parts, instead offering a straightforward look at the sprues etc. I'm personally guilty of this! And I think the reason for that is generally a reviewer wants to be (one of) the first to share the latest and greatest with their peers, and taking parts off sprues to test fit is a slippery slope to building the thing and forgetting your obligation as a reviewer! ;D
That's where proper build reviews come to the fore, especially if you have a reviewer who takes the time to mention specific issues they've encountered.
It could simply be that the reviewer you've read hasn't had the same issues.
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i posted a question on my experience with the airfix eindecker on their forum... and now i cant get into their website.
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MasterKamera, you say you can't get on to the Airfix forum site but thats no problem because I have checked there and see your posts where you are registered under the name Tom?
What was most interesting in the thread about negative reviews was your comment "Its worse on other sites like ww1aircraft modeller. Anything negative just dissapears.."
Also interesting, you only joined the Airfix forum on June 13 and straight away, on the first day, you were attacking this forum.
For the record, we welcome spirited discussions but if you want to snipe at the forum please get our Forum name right to begin with.
Also, I disagree with your post. You say about this forum "anything negative just disappears".
That's not true. You are negative here but you have not disappeared.
Dave Wilson
Gold Coast
Australia
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I must agree with my friend KiwiZac, in an “in box review” I am looking for a review of what is in the box, a more in depth discussion of issues, failures and plusses of the kit will be discussed in a build log, I think...
ciao
edo
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I think there are two reasons:
1. In-box reviews made without actually assembling the thing, so the reviewer hasn’t been able to encounter any issues
2. This is far more seldom, but not non-existent: reviewers giving good reviews to just about anything so they can keep getting free model kits. And before anyone thinks I’m attacking them: no, I don’t mean anyone on this board.
While writing I also came up with no 3 and 4:
3. ”Other”: well, I have built Airfix Eindeckers and had no issues with them. I can’t tell why our experiences differ.
4: some reviewers are just too nice to say bad things, or have a higher tolerance level for fit errors
That said, I stopped putting too much trust in reviews regarding fit (after having read a review praising the 1/72 Roden D.VII in this regard) and try to get impressions from build-logs in addition. I mostly read reviews to get an idea of details, accuracy and decals.
So to sum up: if fit or ease of build is your concern, read build logs.
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... and while it's always good to be forewarned of glitches likely to be encountered in build phase, some "problems" can be overstated and may put prospective purchasers off a perfectly good kit.
I'm thinking specifically of all the in-box reviews of the 1/32 Meng Triplane when it first appeared which drew disproportionate attention to a slight banana bend in the upper wing and a small section of cockpit area detached because of sprue/packing pressures.
The wing took me all of two or three minutes to sort out by vigorous bending and the detached piece took a second or two to re-attach! I've found much worse in the Wingnuts Albatros V-strutters but rarely mentioned, yet the first thing the guys at the club asked when I built mine was how did I fix the WING PROBLEM coz they'd read the daft reviews!
Sandy
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MasterKamera - As a reviewer on this site, I try to give a balanced review. I also point out the flaws in a kit (be it in quality, or accuracy). But... I (and many other reviewers) come at an in-box review from the perspective of a modeller, not a kit assembler. So for me, and for anyone with even a modicum of modelling experience, some flash here or some soft detail there isn't (and should not be) a bother. Hence i'll use terms like 'this shouldn't be too much of a worry for those with a little experience and some sandpaper', etc. I also try to make some comments on what I perceive may be possible buildability issues. Some of these potential issues can be gleaned just by viewing the plastic parts on the sprues.
There are those of us who remember the days waaaaay before Wingnut Wings or the modern Eduard incarnations where we actually had to do some good old fashioned modelling. Not every manufacturer (not even all of the big ones) can make drop-fit kits that take no effort to build. Anyone who has built an early Eduard kit, for example (think of their Pup, Hannover, Morane L, etc) knows what I mean, and those kits were released back in the 90s when we were glad just to get any kits at all (and as an aside, these kits are all still quite buildable, even now). The companies our little niche deal with are often small, and use limited run moulding techniques. I, for one, am simply thrilled that we even get kits of some subjects. So let's not be too harsh if something doesn't fall together.
If you're afraid to get your hands dirty with a little bit of fitting and sanding, and some filler here an there, or if you want to have a swipe at every manufacturer who doesn't manufacture the perfect kit each time every time, then I respectfully suggest you take up knitting (but watch those needles, I wouldn't want you to poke yourself in the eye).
Cheers,
BC
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WHy is it that the reviews never seem to mention ISSUES with the parts in the kits?
Inbox reviews - what I prefer to call kit previews - rarely feature the reviewer taking the time to dry-fit parts, instead offering a straightforward look at the sprues etc. I'm personally guilty of this! And I think the reason for that is generally a reviewer wants to be (one of) the first to share the latest and greatest with their peers, and taking parts off sprues to test fit is a slippery slope to building the thing and forgetting your obligation as a reviewer! ;D
That's where proper build reviews come to the fore, especially if you have a reviewer who takes the time to mention specific issues they've encountered.
It could simply be that the reviewer you've read hasn't had the same issues.
Expanding just a bit on what Zac has said I have only done One In Box Review for this Forum :
https://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=12370.0
I think you will see that I tried to cover the Good, Needs Improvement, and The Not so Good ! This is a review done by studying the parts as they appear on the sprues.
My next step after the review was to do a build Thread. This was done using the kit parts almost as they come Out of the Box. During the build I mentioned issues that I ran into.
https://forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.php?topic=12372.0
I hope this at least points out the difference between an "In Box Review" and a "Build Thread" If you were to look up the current build by Zac you would see He is having a different experience. Not all Modelers address construction in the same way which I think is what Zac was emphasizing!
Perhaps your experience with the Airfix kit is just different than other Modelers have experienced?
RAGIII
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Perhaps your experience with the Airfix kit is just different than other Modelers have experienced?
This is something important to consider. A friend and I have built several of the same Airfix kits and while I have a - quite frankly - jolly and merry trip through the build, smiling at the engineering, he has encountered several fit issues to the point of wondering if it's all worth it and has fought battles with the same plastic. With New Airfix it truly does seem to be a case of "your mileage may vary". I too built the Eindecker and had no problems, but given my friend's experience with the handful of Airfix kits we've shared I can totally understand your experience mK!
Not all kit reviews are created equal. One site I visit doesn't even show photos of the sprues, just the parts layout from the instructions! You can imagine how frustrating I find that when deciding which kit is more accurate and I can't even see the bits!!
We're all here to share our experience and work, and to help one another.
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If you're afraid to get your hands dirty with a little bit of fitting and sanding, and some filler here an there, or if you want to have a swipe at every manufacturer who doesn't manufacture the perfect kit each time every time, then I respectfully suggest you take up knitting (but watch those needles, I wouldn't want you to poke yourself in the eye).
Brad,
With all due respect for your superb building and writing talent, I think you are too hard on the OP. You are too much of a forum role model (in my eyes) to go down as hard as you have.
Fondly,
Gene K
When a person stoops to that level of insulting verbiage, they have truly left any semblence of "role model" well and far behind.
If the person had actually looked at the kit, its an airfix level 2 because
1. parts count
2. pieces need to be glued together and painted
3. the kit doesnt come with glue or paint
the BOX product code is A01, which means that it is supposed to be extremely easy for someone to build. Essentially snaptight level of difficulty..
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MasterKamera, or whatever your real name is....
In the 10 years I have been associated with this Forum - the last four of them as owner/ administrator - I don't think I have encountered such a negative, complaining, aggressive member such as yourself.
Your latest post, an inexcusable attack on Moderator/ reviewer Brad Cancian really defines in my mind what sort of mindset we are dealing with.
The great aspect of this Forum has been the way the members have all been supportive of one another, as friends and fellow modellers, sharing advice on model building and sharing our joint enthusiasm for the subject. It's why I believe this Forum has flourished while others have melted down and vanished.
Since you joined in April I have received two complaints to Moderators about your behaviour, you have privately crossed swords with me about kit reviews and now you have taken it public with a thread that seems to revolve around your fury at being unable to make an entry level Airfix kit and kit reviews not alerting you to the issues you encountered.
This would be a very good time to consider why you are a member on this Forum and more particularly what do you bring to the discussion, other than an abrasive attitude?
Here's some advice- Your future on the Forum very much rests on your shoulders now.
Dave Wilson
Forum Owner & Administrator
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MasterKamera, or whatever your real name is....
In the 10 years I have been associated with this Forum - the last four of them as owner/ administrator - I don't think I have encountered such a negative, complaining, aggressive member such as yourself.
Your latest post, an inexcusable attack on Moderator/ reviewer Brad Cancian really defines in my mind what sort of mindset we are dealing with.
The great aspect of this Forum has been the way the members have all been supportive of one another, as friends and fellow modellers, sharing advice on model building and sharing our joint enthusiasm for the subject. It's why I believe this Forum has flourished while others have melted down and vanished.
Since you joined in April I have received two complaints to Moderators about your behaviour, you have privately crossed swords with me about kit reviews and now you have taken it public with a thread that seems to revolve around your fury at being unable to make an entry level Airfix kit and kit reviews not alerting you to the issues you encountered.
This would be a very good time to consider why you are a member on this Forum and more particularly what do you bring to the discussion, other than an abrasive attitude?
Here's some advice- Your future on the Forum very much rests on your shoulders now.
Dave Wilson
Forum Owner & Administrator
Not sorry, but this was not some response to your shrilly written attack via the private message system. Merely pointing out the flaws in your "authorized reviews" section lead you to turn into a sniveling crybaby. And when you demanded my actual name for us to have any actual "conversation" well merely shows you to be a simpleton that cant take criticism.
This forum was started by someone who no longer lives, and the current version of the forum really hurts that mans vision for it, and hurts his memory and place in the modelling community at large. Des seemed capable of running the forum, and creating a place to put content. I havent dug through many old posts and reviews from while he was alive, but the ones i have seen, it was acceptable to put negative comments into a kit review supplied by a forum sponsor.
NOW with your newly revised forum rules... NO ONE can put up a negative reivew of ANYTHING that comes from a forum sponsor. Perhaps if you turned the site into something beyond paid advertising and a personal showcase for yourself and a few of your friends you could get more membership, and even more forum sponsors.
But then again their is such limited activity on this site, its not even worth a read other then going through 10 year old posts on somehting.
And people complaining about me. Gee, i think i know who complained,, this dave w guy, and some idiot who didnt like that i pointed out its offensive to yell at someone "to do a search" on something, and the only thing that comes up is in relation to a different topic .. and from 2012.
Big deal your a bunch of crybabies.
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Oh well, with a membership in excess of 3,000 I suppose we're bound to get an occasional tit.
His invective might be less risible if he could spell properly.
Dave, rest assured the great majority of us fully appreciate the sterling job you do, for little reward.
as we Scots have in our motto "Nemo me impune lacessit" but we actually say "Wha' dare meddle wi' me"
In appreciation, DW
Sandy
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Dave,
I feel I must respond to what is going here.
Let me begin by saying that I am backing you 100%.
MasterKamera has been given ample opportunity to change his course and tone, but he has shown that he is unwilling to do that. On the contrary, his tone is getting more toxic with every post.
I think Des, looking down, is very proud of what you stand for and what you do to lead this forum in his spirit and honor his legacy.
MasterKamera's tone has bothered me from the beginning, but his last post made my skin crawl. All the members that responded to his posts have been helpful and kind, but this character has shown nothing but disrespect, and I wouldn't mind at all if he left this (OUR!) forum and took his sour business elsewhere.
Sandy,
Your comment made me smile. You are right, we shouldn't let this one man spoil our fun. I think he has been given far more attention than he deserves.
As we Dutch say: "ELMO!". That stands for "Enough, Let's Move On" ;)
Willem
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Odd..the only thing he seems to be a master at is baiting people. Now if you want to be a master baiter that's ok but you usually end, as always, enjoying yourself alone.
Steve
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Touche' Pepperman. :)
Des and I didn't always get along back in the day. I didn't always agree with him, or think he made the right decisions, but you know what? It was HIS forum! Also, I think Dave and the other admins here, who have a thankless job IMHO, do an outstanding job. The membership here is ALWAYS willing to lend a helping hand, no matter the question or experience level.
WD
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Dang, That was a totally Rude reply. I have gone to great lengths to honestly answer his questions. The review I posted the link to clearly shows that it was unbiased, as was My build review. Thanks Dave , and all of the Moderators for all you do! On a positive note he makes Me want to get an Airfix EIII 8)
RAGIII
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MasterKamera, you missed the point to get out of this without completely loosing your face quite a long time ago.
Without any kind of sarcasm: I think you need help. Get a proper psychological treatment or at least talk to someone in person. This internet thing isn’t any good for you.
Andreas
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I believe this thread has run its course and has outstayed its welcome. I hope my fellow admins don't mind if I lock it for further replies.
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Before we close this topic and move on to other modelling subjects, it’s timely to clearly state our Forum policy and approach to reviews.
Despite what one or two might claim, the Forum is not ‘in the pocket’ of any manufacturers, nor do we have any undisclosed deals to promote their products in return for free stuff.
Our reviews clearly identify which company has supplied the item to us for review, and our reviewers take an impartial approach to every item they evaluate.
Brad, Zac and Rick have all given excellent insights into their review approach.
During my journalism career I was involved in reviewing items for several decades – books, records, movies, DVDs and now model items. In all cases the review is written with prospective buyers in mind and addresses the question- is this item worth the money? Do I recommend it?
Our Forum reviews are based around the in-box look because that’s the common ground for all modellers- we open the box and inspect the contents before building. Some modellers are OOB builders, others insist on all of the aftermarket jewellery going. Some are happy with the kit as produced, others will use it as the basis for some creative conversions.
So the in box review is the starting point and the common ground for us all. Our Forum is blessed by having modellers who build straight from the box and others who show us what extra magic can be brought to these kits with aftermarket or their own creative talents. Between our reviews and member build logs and photo posts we cover the field.
Despite what the critics may feel we do not suppress negative comments about the items we review. The companies supplying review samples do so on the understanding we will be fair and impartial. Our reviews will mention a problem or deficiency in a kit if it is evident, but we refuse to pander to those who obsessively attack every new kit to demonstrate their superiority over the model manufacturer.
We have a forum review team to ensure members clearly see this is an impartial review and are not misled by ‘private’ reviews from people who endorse a product but do not disclose they may have a private promotional arrangement with the manufacturer, like the system operated by Internet Influencers who spruik products in return for freebies.
I am happy to discuss our review policy with members and we encourage members to freely discuss models they have purchased or traded. We do not look to suppress discussion of kits, new or old. But we feel all discussions should be open, honest and impartial.
Dave Wilson
Forum Owner & Administrator