forum.ww1aircraftmodels.com
WW1 Aircraft Modeling => Rigging for Everyone => Topic started by: drdave on December 31, 2023, 11:18:58 PM
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Best wishes to Bob for a speedy recovery.
Grim reality of the post Bob Buckle era now upon us! I’m embarking on a RE8 with my last 60 buckles. I haven’t found anything else to be as easy to use as attachment points until now. Proper turnbuckles are not quite right and too spendy really.
What’s everyone else’s plans going forwards? I don’t think I can face churning out hundreds myself…that’s valuable modelling time.
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My sons and I have been giving a lot of thought to the turnbuckle issue, and researching the idea of producing a line of strong, reasonably priced 3D printed types (standard, Albatros, Nieuport, etc.) and anchor points for folks here in the US and Canada. The Gaspatch and ProperPlane items are great, but issues of currency conversion, shipping and turnaround times from Europe simply ain't.
Not sure if there'd be any interest, but I'm throwing the idea out there!
Dutch
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Yes I’d be interested. What we need are small eyelets on a 2mm stem, a direct replacement just to be able to thread through. It’s not turnbuckles per se but rigging attachment points that the bobs stuff does perfectly.
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One can try the model train section of a hobby store for photo etch eyebolts of the required size.
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Hey Dutch, I'd be interested if you went ahead with this project.
Steve
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Not to be a stick in the mud, but twisting eyelets is not that hard or even that time consuming! For anchoring structural rigging, I can't see 3DP resin eyelets being up to the task.
Des' treatise on the subject is still valid: https://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com/page8.html
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There’s a reason we buy bobs stuff. Time. Spare time is for modelling. Twisting hundreds of wires for the RE8 is a complete mojo killer.
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Dr Dave and Steve, check your messages.
And Bo, I wasn't talking about doing printed anchor points, although that might have been the way it came across. Sorry for any confusion, I agree with you 100% that Des's method was (and is) brilliant... I actually find twisting them up relaxing, in some weird Zen kind of way.
Dutch
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Like Dutch I "twist" my own eyelets using very fine copper wire or more often nickel chromium wire. I actually prefer the latter as it is much stronger then the copper version. A fellow modeler shared this little idea with me; the hook fitted into a pin vice is made from the spring of a cheap discarded ball point pen. The wire cut to 1-2 inch length is bent over the hook and then grabbing both ends with a small pliers twisted with tension and then trimmed to a length that can be cut again to desired length later. I can produce 5 to 10 eyelets per minute after some practice and find it no great imposition on modelling time; it's actually relaxing! Reminds me of the old proverb, "a man who gathers and cuts his own firewood is twice warmed". I'll miss Bob's pre-cut tubes for sure however the method in Des' article is a good idea as well.
(https://i.imgur.com/HTJNndM.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/2ixeUHb.jpg)
I hope this is of some help.
Cheers,
Lance
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The eyelet problem has been on my mind, too, since I learned about Bob's health issues. Some time ago I have bought a roll of copper wire 0.125mm diameter.
And having read this thread, having remembered that I read about the tool to twist the eyelets and seeing the excellent tutorial by our Des, I have tried my hand on it.
What I can say, it is perfectly doable and with some skill can be a fine passtime after more demanding modelling jobs ;)
Here are my tools and the first batch of 10 eyelets.
(https://i.ibb.co/dGZLp6k/20240107-112529.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/wLfQS62/20240107-110327.jpg)
But the ballpen spring I used to make the hook has the wire diameter about 0.3mm. I compared my proudly made eyelets with the last examples from Bob and found that the eye is substantially larger
(https://i.ibb.co/LZgFjWL/20240107-110210.jpg)
And here my wife helped me with a donation to my tool batch. An ancient tool used years ago to repair the "falling eyes" in then precious stockings. The hook is smaller but also with a smaller diameter.
(https://i.ibb.co/Th0wH4B/20240107-111632.jpg)
But it produces the eyelets identical to the Bob's ones!
(https://i.ibb.co/tZ3TZm3/20240107-111612.jpg)
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Does anyone remember what Bob was charging for his eyelets?
As I said, I find making them quite relaxing, but apparently a lot of people would rather have a tooth pulled.
Dutch
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Does anyone remember what Bob was charging for his eyelets?
Dutch
1.80 GBP per 10 pack.
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There’s a reason we buy bobs stuff. Time. Spare time is for modelling. Twisting hundreds of wires for the RE8 is a complete mojo killer.
Ok, I hear ya... :)
And Bo, I wasn't talking about doing printed anchor points...
ah, ok, I misunderstood.
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And here my wife helped me with a donation to my tool batch. An ancient tool used years ago to repair the "falling eyes" in then precious stockings. The hook is smaller but also with a smaller diameter.
(https://i.ibb.co/Th0wH4B/20240107-111632.jpg)
I make my own eyelets from copper wire and the buckles etc. from Albion Alloys Micro Nickel Silver Tube.
Also this tool looks amazing Prze! Do you or anyone know the name og the tool?
May have to ask my wife as it looks knitting related :)
I've been using my pinwise with the smallest diameter Albion tube (0.2mm) twisted to a hook, but the "eye" could be a little smaller.
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Been experimenting , tried wire hook and 0.15 CU wire ( on the right ) better results using a bent airbrush needle hook and 0.1 brass wire (on the left) . 20 eyelets took me 10 minutes or so ?
The .135 Infini line I use and also some Prym I had lying around both seem happy to go through the gap
(https://i.postimg.cc/3xcbC42n/IMG-4395.jpg)
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And here my wife helped me with a donation to my tool batch. An ancient tool used years ago to repair the "falling eyes" in then precious stockings. The hook is smaller but also with a smaller diameter.
(https://i.ibb.co/Th0wH4B/20240107-111632.jpg)
Also this tool looks amazing Prze! Do you or anyone know the name og the tool?
May have to ask my wife as it looks knitting related :)
As far as I know knitting uses straight rods. Such a hooky tool is used for crotcheting. But those for crotcheting have usually a thicker hook - my wife has a couple of those but they are useless for our eyelets.
And this very tool I showed seems to be something special for Poland. In 1960s-1990s stockings were so expensive that they were repaired when the holes occured in them - that tool allowed to repair the "dropped" threads to be woven back. There were plenty of such service posts around the country. Nowadays it does not pay off to repair, as the stockings are cheap and the workmanship is not.
I am afraid it will be hard to find a name in English. A hooked needle with a pawl - it is what it is roughly called in this Polish text on that ancient profession:
http://www.ginacezawody.com.pl/repasacja/
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And here my wife helped me with a donation to my tool batch. An ancient tool used years ago to repair the "falling eyes" in then precious stockings. The hook is smaller but also with a smaller diameter.
(https://i.ibb.co/Th0wH4B/20240107-111632.jpg)
Also this tool looks amazing Prze! Do you or anyone know the name og the tool?
May have to ask my wife as it looks knitting related :)
As far as I know knitting uses straight rods. Such a hooky tool is used for crotcheting. But those for crotcheting have usually a thicker hook - my wife has a couple of those but they are useless for our eyelets.
And this very tool I showed seems to be something special for Poland. In 1960s-1990s stockings were so expensive that they were repaired when the holes occured in them - that tool allowed to repair the "dropped" threads to be woven back. There were plenty of such service posts around the country. Nowadays it does not pay off to repair, as the stockings are cheap and the workmanship is not.
I am afraid it will be hard to find a name in English. A hooked needle with a pawl - it is what it is roughly called in this Polish text on that ancient profession:
http://www.ginacezawody.com.pl/repasacja/
I think the item is called a Loop Turner.
The idea is that a dropped stitch or a snag can be caught by the loop's hook on the way through a garment but then the little hinged arm shields the hook on the way back out, so only the dropped/snagged thread is brought back through.
I got one from ebay UK recently from a company called Milward, but the Prze's Polish one seems to have a much finer guage hook. Not sure how good the ebay one will be, but it may have other applications! - not sure if UK link will work
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/364522675303
Sandy
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I think the item is called a Loop Turner.
Loop turner. That makes perfect sense, thank you Sandy, for this input! :)
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The smaller tools are called Latch Hooks. I recently picked one up from eBay. The small ones are used for wigs, but you have to be careful to check the sizes on the description. It does produce nice small loops, but I do actually get smaller better loops from a modified spring from a ballpoint pen, held in a pin vice.
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Thank you for the answer!
I did try to find the "hooks" using my wife's help (in Danish), but had trouble finding something smaller than a 0.5mm hook. Ill keep looking and the new search terms you provided may help :)
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My sons and I have been giving a lot of thought to the turnbuckle issue, and researching the idea of producing a line of strong, reasonably priced 3D printed types (standard, Albatros, Nieuport, etc.) and anchor points for folks here in the US and Canada. The Gaspatch and ProperPlane items are great, but issues of currency conversion, shipping and turnaround times from Europe simply ain't.
Not sure if there'd be any interest, but I'm throwing the idea out there!
Dutch
I recently purchased GasPatch products on Scotts Model workshop, he is a seller on EBAY. They are wonderful ;D ships from SoCal